Author Topic: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)  (Read 29730 times)

Offline barry guerrero

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3928
What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« on: November 15, 2007, 09:14:11 AM »
I'll go first:

A very nice program of orchestral works on Naxos by a Polish composer named Szeligowski (just think Szell and Stokowski). It has a Comedy Overture; Four Polish Dances; a Piano Concerto, and a Concerto For Orchestra. What's not to like?!? All of the works are in a fairly conservative and tonal style, except for the earlier Concerto For Orchestra (which is a bit more spikey). That's a bit on the modern side.



More Kenny Dorham (trumpet) and Lee Morgan (trumpet) reissues on Bluenote Records.




I haven't picked one up yet, but excerpts from the new Chandos recording of Granville Bantock's "Omar Khayyam" sounds pretty intriguing. It's also Gramophone's Record Of The Month.



Bebop Bassoon by Daniel Smith is pretty fun. Yes, it's a jazz bassoon CD. Daniel Smith is the same guy who recorded ALL of the Vivaldi bassoon concertos for ASV.



A Bruckner 7 with Haitink/CSO on CSO Live is decent - not fabulous, but decent.



A lecture/demo./performance DVD of Richard Strauss' "Alpine Symphony", with Kent Nagano conducting his DSO Berlin - I don't own it, but it does look interesting!



Last and most certainly least: the amazing Mona Golabek, and her compilation CD that alternates musical excerpts and romantic poetry, read in a soft and sultry manner by Ms. Golabek herself. She has also written a book about her mother's escape from nazi occupied Vienna.




Offline bluesbreaker

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 103
Re: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2007, 12:51:04 PM »
Bruckner Eighth by Tennstedt/LPO and Jochum/Dresden. Both on EMI.
Bruckner Ninth by Giulini/VPO and again, Jochum / Dresden.
Beethoven Seventh by Tennstedt / NDR on EMI  ;D
Beethoven Fifth and Sixth, by Kurt sanderling and Berlin So.
Berlioz' Symphonie Fantastique by none other than Lenny Bernstein / NYPO!! ;D ;D
Brahms' German Requiem by Tennstedt / LPO & LPC.
All B's!! ;D ;D
Schubert's Unfinished by Giulini (coupled with M9.....you should know which one!)

That's pretty much my classical diet for now...........................Then let's move to my core: instrumental rock and progressive metal!

Dream Theater's Images And Words. Timeless album!


Dream Theater's latest album: Systematic Chaos


Dream Theater:



Pink floyd's Dark Side Of The Moon, and Wish You were Here:




I play guitar myself, and they are my favorite players and my influences:
Eric Johnson


Jeff beck:
Under The Dark Side Of The Glass Moon

Offline akiralx

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 312
Re: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2007, 01:40:06 PM »
Julia Fischer's SACD of Tchaikovsky's Violin Concerto, RNO/Kreizberg - very good if a slightly unromantic performance.

Vadim Repin's Beethoven Violin Concerto, VPO/Muti.  If you don't mind the traditional (i.e. slightly sedate) interpretation, this is very well done, especially by Muti.  The best thing is the coupled Kreutzer sonata with Argerich, where both artists play superbly.

Chailly's Bruckner 2 - one of my very favourite Bruckner symphonies.  Fine performance, in a grand style.  Wakasugi's on Arte Nova is my favourite.

Tchetuev's second volume from his Beethoven Sonata cycle on Caro Mitis.  Very good if not as excellent as his first SACD (op 10/3, Appassionata, Les Adieux).  Superbly recorded.

« Last Edit: November 19, 2007, 11:22:11 AM by akiralx »

Offline John Kim

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2611
Re: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2007, 04:02:27 PM »
Besides Mahler I've been listening to,

Wand/NDR/RCA Beethoven Symphonies
Wagner/Karajan/BPO/DG Wagner Ring cycle
Maazel/BPO/EMI Bruckner 7th
Muti/BPO/EMI Bruckner 4th
Bohm/VPO/DG Bruckner 7th
Barenboim/CSO/DG Bruckner 6th (it's coming!)

John,

Offline barry guerrero

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3928
Re: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2007, 04:37:16 PM »
"Vadim Repin's Beethoven Violin Concerto, VPO/Muti.  If you don't mind the traditional (i.e. slightly sedate) interpretation, this is very well done, especially by Muti.  The best thing is the coupled Kreutzer sonata with Argerich, where both artists play superbly"

I've heard this, and I think it's excellent! I've never enjoyed the Beethoven nearly so much.

Barry

Offline Leo K

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1367
  • You're the best Angie
Re: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2007, 05:05:06 PM »
Besides Vanka's Beethoven cycle, I've been listening to Quartetto Italiano's recordings of the late Beethoven quartets...always loved those recordings...especially the Quartet in Bb Opus.130.

Also, I wrote a small essay on a favorite bluesman who recorded in the 1920's:


Tommy Johnson (c.1896-1956)


"He practically picked it up hisself. He made them songs up hisself and tuned'em up hisself, just air music."

"He just had rambling on his mind. When he stopped to work, he was as good a hand as you'd want to see. he'd do as much work as anybody. But when that notic struck him to hit the road, he didn't tell nobody nothing. He justhit the road. Look for him when you see him."

- Majer Johnson, brother of Tommy Johnson



Complete Recorded Works (1928-1929)



Victor Recordings (tracks 1-8)
http://rs135gc.rapidshare.com/files/68108446/Victor_Recordings.rar


Paramount Recordings (tracks 9-17)
http://rs93tl.rapidshare.com/files/68099393/Paramount_Recordings.rar


I first heard Tommy Johnson in 1999 while I was living in Rochester, MN.  These songs soundtracked life during the frozen Minnesota winter and provided hours of Mississippi company.  His performances demanded my full attention and I listened to every word he sang.  The timbre and phrasing of his vocals manifested mystery and humour, with apparently a more relaxed musical style in comparison with contemporaries Son House and Charlie Patton.  His relaxed manner suggests one who quietly suffers his pain, and deeply reflects the ramification of addiction and loneliness.  How frusterating to find a great man and artist, only to find there is hardly any deep biographical material to dive into, but I found it's all there in the songs, each a chapter from his life, edited by Tommy himself.  And what he chooses to disclose revolves around his exploits with alcohol and women. 

I also love his subtle guitar, which seems to tick away like a rusting Grandfather clock, persistant despite everything.  In the Victor recordings Tommy is joined with Charlie McCoy, who plays the mandolin-like tremolos under Tommy's guitar.  In the Paramount recordings we hear Johnson in a band setting on a few of the tracks (with the New Orleans Nehi Boys), as well as a unknown kazoo player on I Wonder To Myself, which is my favorite Johnson recording, featuring a solo guitar performance that has the most exciting acoustic rhythm guitar I've heard on record.  Yes, there is alot of scratches on this 78, but the guitar somehow arises from the amber of time, and what we hear is golden. 

Technically, Paramount didn't issue high quality 78's, and the records have deteriorated ever time, so the sound quality is not as good as the recordings done for Victor.  Yet, this poor quality actually aids the inherent bleakness of the Paramount songs, especially Lonesome Home Blues (especially bleak when compared with the two versions done for Victor), Alcohol and Jake Blues, and the two untitled songs.

Cool Drink of Water Blues, Big Road Blues, and Bye Bye Blues are my favorite Victor recordings, but every Victor song is rich with story and instrumental picture conjuring...the landscape of Mississippi and his troubled mind and body ever present.  The songs from this session are not as bleak as the paramount session, but like the later session the rhythm is ever ticking away in relaxed measure, taking all the time the song needs to state it's life and creed, evocative as a photo album or memory manifest as dream, as when Tommy sings of his wife in Maggie Campbell Blues:

Cryin', who did you know
Comin' down the road?
Comin' down the road
Umm, who does ya know
Comin' down the road?
Well, it look like Maggie, little bit
But she walks too, slow

Now, the sun is gonna shine
My back door ov'r the trees
My light due somedays
Ooo-ooo
Come your turn and
My light due someday
And the wind gon' change all
Blow my blues away

Now, CC rider
See what you done, done
See what you done, done
Umm-mmm
CC rider
See what you done, done
You done made me love you
Now you're through
Tryin'-a throw me down

Well, I'm gon' away, now
Won't be back 'till fall
Won't be back 'till fall
Well, I'm gon' away, now
Won't be back 'till fall
'Till I meet my good gal faror
Won't be back a'tol

Now, who that yonder
Comin' down the road?
Comin' down the road?
Umm-mmm
Who's that yonder
Comin' down the road?
Does it look like Maggie, a little bit
But she walks too, slow.

Umm-mm, goin' baby
Won't be back' till fall
Won't be back' till fall
I'm goin' away, long
I'll be back in fall
Well, I might meet my new gal
But I, I won't be back a'tol.




--Leo

Offline sperlsco

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 579
Re: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2007, 06:50:51 PM »
I was on a tour of Shosty's 7th symphony over the past couple of weeks, including ones I liked from Lennie/CSO, Jarvi, Bychkov, Jansons I and II, Berglund, Caetani, and Masur, and a few I did not from Temirkanov, Gergiev, and Yablonksy. 

I am going to see the Brahms Piano Cto No. 1 this weekend performed by Ax, Graf, and my hometown heroes the HSO.  As such, I've been on a tour of this concerto, so far to include:  Freire/Chailly, Arrau/Haitink, Buchbinder/Harnoncourt, and a new download from Tiberghien/Belohlavek/BBC SO (via eMusic).  I'll probably listen to Ax/Haitink (or is it Levine?) on the way to the concert. 
Scott

Offline stillivor

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 296
Re: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2007, 08:58:06 PM »
  Just befor brief reply, I've sent a query to admin bit about returning with new email address.

  I'm always buying secondhand LPs, tapes, even CDs, esp. of stuff I don't have already. So, I'm always listening to summay different.

  Lately, Ravel orchestral.

  Popular hits of the 40s, esp. Marie a la T, Dorsey.

  Grand Entry Song of Great lake Indians

  First ever (1913) recording of Beet. 5


    Nice to be back

    Still    Ivor

Offline barry guerrero

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3928
Re: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« Reply #8 on: November 16, 2007, 08:52:46 AM »
"Grand Entry Song of Great lake Indians"

What's that?!? Sounds like it could be a number straight out of "Little Mary Sunshine".

Barry

Offline sbugala

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 379
Re: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« Reply #9 on: November 16, 2007, 03:37:56 PM »
I've been on a huge Vaughan Williams kick recently. I sometimes make this pronouncement to myself that his Nine are as great as Bruckner's and Dvorak's.  His Ninth is under-rated, and weird.   I'd love to hear it live someday.  The finale is kinda chilling and beautiful, but not a farewell like Mahler's or Bruckner's Ninth.  But it IS an ending.  Those weird saxes coming out as those huge cresendos (sp?) tower over the orchestra is awesome.

For a long time, I had various interpretations by various conductors. Then I felt like I HAD to have one guy doing it, so I picked Haitink, and traded others in to used record stores. I've come to find some of my old picks were better, like Previn and the RPO in the Symphony No. 5, or Slatkin in others.  Now, I'm off to discover and sometimes rediscover some versions I traded in. 

Offline barry guerrero

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3928
Re: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« Reply #10 on: November 16, 2007, 04:22:00 PM »
"I sometimes make this pronouncement to myself that his (V-Ws') nine are as great as Bruckner's and Dvorak's.  His Ninth is under-rated, and weird.   I'd love to hear it live someday.  The finale is kinda chilling and beautiful, but not a farewell like Mahler's or Bruckner's Ninth.  But it IS an ending.  Those weird saxes coming out as those huge cresendos (sp?) tower over the orchestra is awesome".

Yep; I agree with this entire paragraph. I think that V-Ws' nine are more consistant in quality than either Bruckner or Dvorak (Tony D's late ones are fantastic though). I also love his 9th - frankly, more than the Mahler 9th. Then again, I like the Bruckner 9th - sans conjectural finale - better than the Mahler 9th too. And even though we've all heard it twenty million times, I think it's extremely difficult to beat the Dvorak 9th. I like Mahler's TRUE 9th symphony more, which is "DLvdE". I also prefer the 10th; especially in the Carpenter or Samale/Mazzuca versions. That's just me.

Barry

Offline Leo K

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1367
  • You're the best Angie
Re: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« Reply #11 on: November 16, 2007, 09:13:15 PM »
"I sometimes make this pronouncement to myself that his (V-Ws') nine are as great as Bruckner's and Dvorak's.  His Ninth is under-rated, and weird.   I'd love to hear it live someday.  The finale is kinda chilling and beautiful, but not a farewell like Mahler's or Bruckner's Ninth.  But it IS an ending.  Those weird saxes coming out as those huge cresendos (sp?) tower over the orchestra is awesome".

Yep; I agree with this entire paragraph. I think that V-Ws' nine are more consistant in quality than either Bruckner or Dvorak (Tony D's late ones are fantastic though). I also love his 9th - frankly, more than the Mahler 9th. Then again, I like the Bruckner 9th - sans conjectural finale - better than the Mahler 9th too. And even though we've all heard it twenty million times, I think it's extremely difficult to beat the Dvorak 9th. I like Mahler's TRUE 9th symphony more, which is "DLvdE". I also prefer the 10th; especially in the Carpenter or Samale/Mazzuca versions. That's just me.

Barry

Looks like I should explore Ralph Vaughn Williams!  Back to the used LP store I go!!

--Leo

Offline Leo K

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1367
  • You're the best Angie
Re: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« Reply #12 on: November 16, 2007, 09:27:59 PM »
Speaking of Beethoven (who've I've been listening to again), here's alittle something I wrote for another forum (where folks are rather new to Beethoven):

Practically everyone knows the first movement of the 5th Symphony, at least the beginning bars.  As the symphony unfolds, a grand journey from darkness to light, or from struggle to freedom is achieved in a direct manner that astonishes on practically every hearing.  With the exception of Mozart’s late G minor Symphony, no other symphony is so driven and thematically compressed, with the famous four note “fate” motive inherent in almost every bar.  Concise and lean, the first four notes sounded like a flippant joke to first audiences.  Perhaps this is a kind of musical joke.  After all, Beethoven's pupil Carl Czerny claimed the famous motto of the 5th Symphony derived from the call of a finch, yet as the music progresses, a demanding architecture unfolds, one-pointed and serious.

Depending on the performance or interpretation, this first movement can sound angry, defiant, heroic, terrifying or all these things and much more...a testament to Beethoven’s genius.  I prefer the movement to sound profoundly angry.  Not anger over a small frustration, but over a great affront to truth, or even over the deterioration of the body (Beethoven’s own illness and deafness comes to mind).  There is a wonderful purifying quality to this “angry” and volatile music.  Indeed the whole work proceeds like a session in a psychoanalyst’s office.  From the initial anger of the first movement we hear a quieter reflection from the “patient” (perhaps discussing a dream or a recalled memory) during the second movement.  This seems to be questioned by the psychoanalyst during the third movement, and an argument and hashing out between the patient and doctor ensues until we reach the finale, where revelation and healing is received and celebrated, even through a return to the dilemma just before the end.  I imagine the psychoanalyst office to be bright and sunny, thanks to a large picture window over the patient.  I also imagine the patient had to walk for miles, like Beethoven’s walks through the Austrian countryside, through bright, cold sunshine and piles of light snow to get to this bright office.  The psychoanalyst would be a beautiful women, a women who appears in the patient’s dreams, causing dilemma and wonder for the patient during his search for truth.       

Personally, I have always been entranced by the epic second movement, a music suggesting wandering in a grand landscape, very Schubertian.  A military sounding fanfare interrupts the flow during the course of the argument, a hint of the triumph in the finale.  The introspective woodwinds are a total contrast to the extrovert brass and timpani, a questioning over all that has appeared before, or perhaps resignation, and the soft wandering of the quieter sections foreshadows the pastoral pastures of the 6th symphony.  The flutes in the second movement always brings to mind Beethoven’s so called Heiligenstadt Testament, written in a state of depression over his deafness and loneliness in 1802 in the town of Heiligenstadt, a country retreat about an hour away from Vienna.  Here is an excerpt:


For my brothers Carl and Johann Beethoven

Oh you men who think or say that I am malevolent, stubborn, or misanthropic, how greatly do you wrong me. You do not know the secret cause which makes me seem that way to you. From childhood on, my heart and soul have been full of the tender feeling of goodwill, and I was even inclined to accomplish great things. But, think that for six years now I have been hopelessly afflicted, made worse by senseless physicians, from year to year deceived with hopes of improvement, finally compelled to face the prospect of a lasting malady (whose cure will take years or, perhaps, be impossible).

Though born with a fiery, active temperament, even susceptible to the diversions of society, I was soon compelled to isolate myself, to live life alone. If at times I tried to forget all this, oh, how harshly was I flung back by the doubly sad experience of my bad hearing. Yet it was impossible for me to say to people, "Speak Louder, shout, for I am deaf". Oh, how could I possibly admit an infirmity in the one sense which ought to be more perfect in me than others, a sense which I once possessed in the hightést perfection, a perfection such as few in my profession enjoy or ever have enjoyed. – Oh I cannot do it; therefore forgive me when you see me draw back when I would have gladly mingled with you.
       
My misfortune is doubly painful to me because I am bound to be misunderstood; for me there can be no relaxation with my fellow men, no refined conversations, no mutual exchange of ideas. I must live almost alone, like one who has been banished. I can mix with society only as much as true necessity demands. If I approach near to people a hot terror seizes upon me, and I fear being exposed to the danger that my condition might be noticed. Thus it has been during the last six months which I have spent in the country. By ordering me to spare my hearing as much as possible, my intelligent doctor almost fell in with my own present frame of mind, though sometimes I ran counter to it by yielding to my desire for companionship.

But what a humiliation for me when someone standing next to me heard a flute in the distance and I heard nothing, or someone standing next to me heard a shepherd singing and again I heard nothing. Such incidents drove me almost to despair; a little more of that and I would have ended my life. It was only my art that held me back. Oh, it seemed to me impossible to leave the world until I had forth all that I felt was within me. So I endured this wretched existence, truly wretched for so susceptible a body, which can be thrown by a sudden change from the best condition to the worst. Patience, they say, is what I must now choose for my guide, and I have done so - I hope my determination will remain firm to endure until it pleases the inexorable Parcae to break the thread. Perhaps I shall get better, perhaps not; I am ready. - Forced to become a philosopher already in my twenty-eight year, oh, it is not easy, and for the artist much more difficult than for anyone else. Divine One, thou seest my inmost soul thou knowest that therein dwells the love of mankind and the desire to do good. Oh, fellow men, when at some point you read this, consider then that you have done me injustice. Someone who has had misfortune may console himself to find a similar case to his, who despite all the limitations of Nature nevertheless did everything within his powers to become accepted among worthy artist and men.

   

The sound world of the 6th Symphony, the “Pastoral”, is completely the opposite.  Where the 5th is concise, the 6th is leisurely.  Beethoven titles the first movement an “awakening of cheerful feelings upon arrival in the country.” As the symphony progresses we are treated to various vignettes of country existence.  Even a storm appears to break up a celebration dance of pheasants, but the storm disperses quickly, replaced by the calm thanksgiving of the finale (the transition to the finale is among the most sublime of all symphonic literature).  Despite the programmatic aspect of the work, the symphony is formally and structurally as sound as the 5th, just not as obvious.

Again, the highlight for me is the second movement, “by the Brook” as Beethoven titles it.  In the second movement we walk along a brook, and hear various species of birds chirp over the running of a river.  Here, Beethoven includes references to bird song, and even names the types of birds at one point in the score; nightingale (flute), quail (oboe), and cuckoo (clarinet).  It is interesting to note how the motto of the 5th is subtly evoked between the quail and the cuckoo.   

As musicologist Raymond Knapp reveals in his essay, A Tale of Two Symphonies: Converging Narratives of Divine Reconciliation in Beethoven’s Fifth and Sixth, the 5th and 6th can be seen as a pair, not thematically, but in structure and concept.  Raymond Knapp has shown how the outline, or structure of the 6th is essentially modeled upon the structure of the 5th.  Using the rigorous structure of the 5th as a model may have helped prevent the programmatic aspect of the “pastoral” symphony from sounding like a series of separate vignettes. Conceptually, the 6th is similar to the 5th in terms of the introspective journey. Not a journey from darkness to light, as in the 5th, but a journey of reflection towards thanksgiving.  That Beethoven could come up with two completely different musical worlds, even by using the same musical and structural devices for both works, is truly a wonder.

I uploaded the article for anyone interested on reading more on the similarities between these two symphonies:

A Tale of Two Symphonies: Converging Narratives of Divine Reconciliation in Beethoven’s Fifth and Sixth

http://rs171tl.rapidshare.com/files/67164512/Beethovenarticle.pdf


I used to ponder these two symphonies during long walks along forests surrounding a community college in Rochester, MN.  This small college (where I studied music) had a periodical called The Musical Quarterly, and I loved to walk to the college to look up articles on these works, as well and Mahler and Ives among others.  The “nature” meditation of the Pastoral Symphony struck me as most profound and very funny...Beethoven writing “Cuckoo” over a bar of music in the score was just hilarious.  I knew Beethoven took long hikes amongst the countryside to write music and get ideas, and even sing loudly while he sketched notes onto a pocket sketchbook, or just walk with his hands clasped behind his back.  This image of him walking haunts me to this day...it is a powerful image of independence. 

His fourth Piano Concerto, in G Major has a similar pastoral quality.  The music is soft, gentle...it questions in a state of surrender.  The main theme evokes the 5th symphony, turns the motto of the 5th inside out towards a quieter reflection.  This piano concerto doesn’t feel like a journey towards a goal.  The still-life meditation of the middle movement (strings and piano only) is surrounded by two landscape views outside Vienna, as heard in the allegro movements.  The short central movement is the heart of the concerto.  The music is almost operatic, proceeding like a recitative, except we never hear the aria that usually follows the recitative.  As in Ives’s Unanswered Question, the strings never answer the piano’s interior questions...rather the answer is hidden by the question itself.   I can’t help but remember a woman named Antonie Bretano (1780-1869), the women thought to be Beethoven’s “Immortal Beloved”...a woman he loved but last saw in 1812. 


Antonie Brentano

Beethoven’s three letters to his Immortal Beloved were found after his death in 1827.  Found in a drawer in his desk, it is not known if these letters were actually sent, or returned by the addressee.  Here are his three letters to her:   

(The first letter)
July 6, in the morning

My angel, my all, my very self - Only a few words today and at that with pencil (with yours) - Not till tomorrow will my lodgings be definitely determined upon - what a useless waste of time - Why this deep sorrow when necessity speaks - can our love endure except through sacrifices, through not demanding everything from one another; can you change the fact that you are not wholly mine, I not wholly thine - Oh God, look out into the beauties of nature and comfort your heart with that which must be - Love demands everything and that very justly - thus it is to me with you, and to your with me. But you forget so easily that I must live for me and for you; if we were wholly united you would feel the pain of it as little as I - My journey was a fearful one; I did not reach here until 4 o'clock yesterday morning. Lacking horses the post-coach chose another route, but what an awful one; at the stage before the last I was warned not to travel at night; I was made fearful of a forest, but that only made me the more eager - and I was wrong. The coach must needs break down on the wretched road, a bottomless mud road. Without such postilions as I had with me I should have remained stuck in the road. Esterhazy, traveling the usual road here, had the same fate with eight horses that I had with four - Yet I got some pleasure out of it, as I always do when I successfully overcome difficulties - Now a quick change to things internal from things external. We shall surely see each other soon; moreover, today I cannot share with you the thoughts I have had during these last few days touching my own life - If our hearts were always close together, I would have none of these. My heart is full of so many things to say to you - ah - there are moments when I feel that speech amounts to nothing at all - Cheer up - remain my true, my only treasure, my all as I am yours. The gods must send us the rest, what for us must and shall be -
Your faithful LUDWIG.


(The second letter)
 Evening, Monday, July 6

You are suffering, my dearest creature - only now have I learned that letters must be posted very early in the morning on Mondays to Thursdays - the only days on which the mail-coach goes from here to K. - You are suffering - Ah, wherever I am, there you are also - I will arrange it with you and me that I can live with you. What a life!!! thus!!! without you - pursued by the goodness of mankind hither and thither - which I as little want to deserve as I deserve it - Humility of man towards man - it pains me - and when I consider myself in relation to the universe, what am I and what is He - whom we call the greatest - and yet - herein lies the divine in man - I weep when I reflect that you will probably not receive the first report from me until Saturday - Much as you love me - I love you more - But do not ever conceal yourself from me - good night - As I am taking the baths I must go to bed - Oh God - so near! so far! Is not our love truly a heavenly structure, and also as firm as the vault of heaven?


(The third letter)
Good morning, on July 7

Though still in bed, my thoughts go out to you, my Immortal Beloved, now and then joyfully, then sadly, waiting to learn whether or not fate will hear us - I can live only wholly with you or not at all - Yes, I am resolved to wander so long away from you until I can fly to your arms and say that I am really at home with you, and can send my soul enwrapped in you into the land of spirits - Yes, unhappily it must be so - You will be the more contained since you know my fidelity to you. No one else can ever possess my heart - never - never - Oh God, why must one be parted from one whom one so loves. And yet my life in V is now a wretched life - Your love makes me at once the happiest and the unhappiest of men - At my age I need a steady, quiet life - can that be so in our connection? My angel, I have just been told that the mailcoach goes every day - therefore I must close at once so that you may receive the letter at once - Be calm, only by a calm consideration of our existence can we achieve our purpose to live together - Be calm - love me - today - yesterday - what tearful longings for you - you - you - my life - my all - farewell. Oh continue to love me - never misjudge the most faithful heart of your beloved.
ever thine
ever mine
ever ours



Offline sbugala

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 379
Re: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2007, 03:32:05 AM »
"I sometimes make this pronouncement to myself that his (V-Ws') nine are as great as Bruckner's and Dvorak's.  His Ninth is under-rated, and weird.   I'd love to hear it live someday.  The finale is kinda chilling and beautiful, but not a farewell like Mahler's or Bruckner's Ninth.  But it IS an ending.  Those weird saxes coming out as those huge cresendos (sp?) tower over the orchestra is awesome".

Yep; I agree with this entire paragraph. I think that V-Ws' nine are more consistant in quality than either Bruckner or Dvorak (Tony D's late ones are fantastic though). I also love his 9th - frankly, more than the Mahler 9th. Then again, I like the Bruckner 9th - sans conjectural finale - better than the Mahler 9th too. And even though we've all heard it twenty million times, I think it's extremely difficult to beat the Dvorak 9th. I like Mahler's TRUE 9th symphony more, which is "DLvdE". I also prefer the 10th; especially in the Carpenter or Samale/Mazzuca versions. That's just me.

Barry
As much as I love Shostakovich, I'd probably rank RVW's Nine as being as fine as his, too.  Mind you, that isn't meant as a slight to old Dmitri.    I think about the time when I was young and clueless, and I was driving around in my car when I tuned into a Saint Louis Symphony Orchestra concert that was rebroadcast.  I was blown away by the mysterious work I was listening to which seemed so 20th Century, and so powerful.  It ended up being the RVW Symphony No. 6 led by Andrew Davis during a guest appearance.  So oddly enough, I have this thought that Vaughan Williams may be more daring than we generally want to believe, only because we've been fed waaaay too many Tallis and Greensleeves Fantasias. 

Barry, like you, I think RVW's symphonies are more consistent in quality.  The only one I don't quite "get" although I love many moments of it is the Sea Symphony. But I'm trying. 

So what is your favorite version of the RVW Ninth?  I like Boult's first one on Everest, and the Slatkin, quite a bit. 

Offline sbugala

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 379
Re: What are we listening to? (outside of Mahler)
« Reply #14 on: November 17, 2007, 03:33:12 AM »
"I sometimes make this pronouncement to myself that his (V-Ws') nine are as great as Bruckner's and Dvorak's.  His Ninth is under-rated, and weird.   I'd love to hear it live someday.  The finale is kinda chilling and beautiful, but not a farewell like Mahler's or Bruckner's Ninth.  But it IS an ending.  Those weird saxes coming out as those huge cresendos (sp?) tower over the orchestra is awesome".

Yep; I agree with this entire paragraph. I think that V-Ws' nine are more consistant in quality than either Bruckner or Dvorak (Tony D's late ones are fantastic though). I also love his 9th - frankly, more than the Mahler 9th. Then again, I like the Bruckner 9th - sans conjectural finale - better than the Mahler 9th too. And even though we've all heard it twenty million times, I think it's extremely difficult to beat the Dvorak 9th. I like Mahler's TRUE 9th symphony more, which is "DLvdE". I also prefer the 10th; especially in the Carpenter or Samale/Mazzuca versions. That's just me.

Barry

Looks like I should explore Ralph Vaughn Williams!  Back to the used LP store I go!!

--Leo

Enjoy! Let us know if you like what you discover. 

 

SMF spam blocked by CleanTalk