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General Category => Gustav Mahler and Related Discussions => Topic started by: umbernisitani on January 15, 2014, 12:01:54 PM
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Avie is releasing Gilbert Kaplan's 3rd recording of Mahler 2nd, this time a chamber orchestra arrangement consisting of 56 musicians.
http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/Avie/AV2290 (http://www.prestoclassical.co.uk/r/Avie/AV2290)
In my opinion, while this arrangement would probably make the work even more accessible and popular for the performers, reducing a work of such enormous proportions to something a sinfonietta or chamber orchestra will mean that some of Mahler's grandiose vision will inevitably have to be sacrificed. But what do I know; I haven't even heard it.
Thoughts?
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My reaction is what would Mahler himself think about the reduced scoring arrangement?
Wade
P.S. - Early critical reviews and cost will determine whether or not I'll buy it.
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Exactly. It depends on just how good a job somebody did in making the actual orchestration of the reduction.
That said, I recently went to an M2 performance at Stanford University's new Bing Concert Hall that was very much an, 'in your face' type performance. The hall has a big stage and relatively small audience capacity. Not once did it cross my mind that the symphony could have sounded better with a reduction in forces. In fact, my thought was, "Mahler would love this".
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I think this arrangement for smaller orchestra is a waste of time. But then again, I don't have the resources Kaplan has to play with the music as he wishes. That said, his recordings of the M2 are favorites of mine.
--Todd
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I enjoyed Kaplan's Vienna 2nd. But rather than make the 3rd recording, wouldn't it be better for Kaplan to record the other symphonies? I'd like to hear his take on the 5th (since he recorded the adagietto).
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...wouldn't it be better for Kaplan to record the other symphonies?
Since having an epiphany during a 1965 Stokowski performance of Mahler 2, Mr. Kaplan has been obsessed with the work. He even owns the original manuscript. He's researched its performance traditions and studied podium technique with some of the great conductors of our time, all for the purpose of conducting this one symphony. It's the only complete work he's ever recorded—quite possibly the only complete work he could record. He's a one-trick pony—the ultimate specialist-conductor.
James
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He's a one-trick pony—the ultimate specialist-conductor.
And to understand, appreciate, and most of all to love such a masterwork as M2, is in my humble opinion, right up there with the highest acclaim to which any mortal can aspire.
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Does anyone know what the reduced instrumentation consists of? For example, is there a choir? Has the organ been kicked out? Has the off-stage been cut? Or is it all the same instruments, but fewer of them?
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Does anyone know what the reduced instrumentation consists of? For example, is there a choir? Has the organ been kicked out? Has the off-stage been cut? Or is it all the same instruments, but fewer of them?
Choir, soloists, and organ remain. Reduced instrumentation in the manner of the scaled-down versions of M4 and DLvdE done for/by Arnold Schoenberg. Full details here:
http://www.universaledition.com/2-Symphonie-for-soli-mixed-choir-small-orchestra-reduzierte-Fassung-Kaplan-Mathes-Gilbert-Kaplan/composers-and-works/composer/3876/work/13881
James
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It's hilarious to note that Kaplan had to reduce Mahler's huge army of 10 horns to a mere 3. They could play Beethoven's Eroica immediately after the M2 concert with this kind of forces. (I'm just saying--not that it's musical or wise to do so.)
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"had to reduce Mahler's huge army of 10 horns to a mere 3"
Where'd you find that out?!? Can you tell us more about the instrumentation. Thanks.
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Where'd you find that out?!? Can you tell us more about the instrumentation. Thanks.
Check this link, which I posted earlier:
http://www.universaledition.com/2-Symphonie-for-soli-mixed-choir-small-orchestra-reduzierte-Fassung-Kaplan-Mathes-Gilbert-Kaplan/composers-and-works/composer/3876/work/13881
James
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Thanks for that link, James. It's interesting to see the instrumentation. It annoys me however that they use the generic term 'percussion' as if the actual instruments don't really matter: I want to know if we still have 2 tam-tams and bells :P
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Thanks for that link, James. It's interesting to see the instrumentation. It annoys me however that they use the generic term 'percussion' as if the actual instruments don't really matter: I want to know if we still have 2 tam-tams and bells :P
Well, we'll just have to buy the CD, listen to it carefully, and report back here with all the nits to pick.
Wade
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Indeed we will, Wade. Indeed we will :)
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Here's what I find a tad ironic: all of the 'big' recordings of M2 from Vienna have been made in the Musikverein, which is a rectangular, shoe-box shaped hall. As a result, the stage ends up rather crammed for works that require a large chorus. That's not to the mention the relatively weak and 'wheezy' sounding organ in the room (Kaplan's VPO M2 had the organ from Berlin's Philharmonie dubbed in). Large works recorded in the Musikverein often times sound rather 'boxy' and somewhat muddled (Abbado's "Gurrelieder" comes to mind).
In contrast to that, the Wiener Konzerthaus is pretty much ideal for works that require lots of instruments, large chorus and a pipe organ. Bernstein's Vienna M8 that is out on dvd was recorded there (1975). Better still, is the recording that Decca made of Janacek's "Glagolitic" Mass in the Konzerthaus, with the VPO conducted by Chailly. The organ sounds fabulous, as does the choral work (since they're not all cramped up in the back). Yet, Kaplan's reduction is being recorded in that bigger hall. It might sound great if the reduction itself isn't a hindrance. Keep in mind that Avie makes very good sounding recordings.
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It's now available to hear on Spotify - you can draw your own conclusions over the sound as a whole (I liked it); but tell me, how is it possible for the tam-tams to mess it up at the very end? It's not difficult - the score is very clear, but here it is completely mis-timed and even leaves out the final hit. I wouldn't expect this from a major recording by one of the leading interpreters of Mahler's Resurrection symphony. I don't see this as a re-write of the part, but clearly as an error.
Thoughts?
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Does this sort of thing make Mahler insufficiently "Special Event"? Does it contribute to the critique that there's "too much Mahler" being performed (at the expense of his contemporaries, as Leon Botstein has observed)?
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An easy observation for Botstein to make, but who would he suggest should get more attention? Zemlinsky? James Conlon has pretty much recorded ALL Zemlinsky. Berg? Berg is great, but he just wasn't all that prolific. Weinberg is getting recorded by Naxos now (I think he came a bit later). When record labels DO record other composers of that period, the buying public just isn't all that interested.