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General Category => Gustav Mahler and Related Discussions => Topic started by: barry guerrero on July 22, 2017, 01:24:18 AM
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I want to hear from those of you who have 'lived' with the Gamzou version of M10 far a while now, and have listened to it at least a few times. Does it wear well on repeated listenin? . . . is it just too over the top? . . . etc.
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Awful. There should be a ban on completions of Mahler's Tenth, Bruckner's Ninth (now we have also Gerd Schaller's version...), and on multiple critical editions of Bruckner's Symphonies. People should focus on playing what we have in the best possible way.
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Well I certainly can't argue with that thought.
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Ugh! I wanted to like the Gamzou, I really did. But between his inspirations, interventions, and conducting I just can't take it. As it so happens, the past couple of weeks I've spent time with every completion of the 10th that has been recorded: Cooke (all 3), Barshai, Gamzou, Wheeler, Carpenter, Cohrs/Samale, Mazzetti (both)...and I've come to the conclusion that the only one that really works is Cooke. And even it still has quite a few moments that just don't sound like Mahler. Still, it's the best thing out there. Sanderling, Rattle, or Levine are just fine. No doubt someone else will try their hand at the 10th, but I can't imagine why.
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I really like the new Dausgaard/Seattle S.O. one. Levine is simply too slow for me, but he does have Philly!
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Awful. There should be a ban on completions...Bruckner's Ninth...
I have mixed feelings about this. The 3-movement 9th has never seemed quite right, and adding Te Deum as the last movement made no sense. A few years I had the privilege of playing William Carragan's latest thoughts on the complete 4-movement symphony. I played 3rd/contra bassoon. It was really thrilling to play it, and as an orchestra member it made complete sense. It surely wasn't what Bruckner would have done, but it is a convincing ending - and of the several alternate versions I've heard, it was as good as any. Carragan, a physicist by profession, did a remarkable job and maybe it's his non-musician approach that allowed him to work without the biases a trained musician would have had. But seeing as there are several versions of the 9th now, enough!
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What makes more sense to me is Te Deum, intermission, symphony 9 (existing three movement version), go home.
By the way, Mahler thought very highly of the Te Deum.
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Awful. There should be a ban on completions...Bruckner's Ninth...
I have mixed feelings about this. The 3-movement 9th has never seemed quite right, and adding Te Deum as the last movement made no sense. A few years I had the privilege of playing William Carragan's latest thoughts on the complete 4-movement symphony. I played 3rd/contra bassoon. It was really thrilling to play it, and as an orchestra member it made complete sense. It surely wasn't what Bruckner would have done, but it is a convincing ending - and of the several alternate versions I've heard, it was as good as any. Carragan, a physicist by profession, did a remarkable job and maybe it's his non-musician approach that allowed him to work without the biases a trained musician would have had. But seeing as there are several versions of the 9th now, enough!
Wow I just checked Carragan's site there are some cool articles there. I have to share this because I find it so interesting:
http://carragan.com/composer-anton-bruckner/tempo-studies-bruckners-fifth-symphony/ (http://carragan.com/composer-anton-bruckner/tempo-studies-bruckners-fifth-symphony/)
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I'm going to rub some people the wrong way and I'll just have to bear (bare?) with that. I don't have a 'theoretical' problem about a finale for the 9th (actually, I do because the first three movements are so perfect). It's just that the material that they do have, quite frankly, stinks! It sounds much more like a first movement to a 10th symphony than it does a finale to the 9th.
Furthermore, what is the point of bothering with all this if a coda - by Bruckner, not someone else - doesn't exist? . . . the point of EVERY Bruckner finale is the coda, is it not?
To me, Bruckner 9 is much like Schubert's "Unfinished": it's perfect as it currently exists (and I actually prefer it to Mahler 9).
But just to clear, I have a 'live and let live' outlook on things: if people want to hear a conjectural finale to their Bruckner 9, I ain't gonna stop 'em. I'm just not buying a ticket to THAT concert unless a true coda by Bruckner is finally unearthed.