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General Category => Gustav Mahler and Related Discussions => Topic started by: Leo K on November 28, 2008, 10:39:41 AM
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Because I'm not doing much this thanksgiving season (except lots of school work), I thought I'd gather my M6 library together and hear what my favorites are as of the end of this year. After a couple weeks of M6 bliss...here are the ones that most impressed me...I'll stick to commercial recordings this time:
1. Bernstein/VPO/DG (Extraordinary...more than I realized. Hearing Eschenbach inspired me to return to the ol' sturm and drang M6...and this Bernstein really beats all in this dept...when it comes down to brass tax, I love this kind of playing for the M6 the most)
2. Sanderling/St.Petersburg (A great balance between sturm and drang, and the classical idealization the M6 tries to be)
3. Bertini/KRSO/EMI (Just really love the flow and the details...one after another details just flash out and dissapear into the grand structure unfolding before our ears...the andante here is alone worth the price of admission...another great finale as well)
4. Horenstein/Bournmouth/BBC Legends (Never heard such an objective vision for this work, very unique...and like Bertini the details really draw me into the overall work...the scherzo is particulary good...sadly the finale doesn't quite live up to what the performance was building towards...but very interesting, and keeps me returning regardless, like the allure of an unfinished Cezanne painting)
5. Karajan/BPO/DG (Love the refined sound here...develops a different mood altogether for the usually dark and heroic M6...a unique sound world is presented...full of grand space, and glacier-like coolness)
These are truly the creme of the crop in my listening room...especially the Bernstein. Revisting this recording was a revelation the other night, and I relistened tonight to make sure...but I truly feel this is one of the most incredible performances of anything I've heard. Favorite moments include:
--The trumpet near the beginning of the development in I...truly sounding like the cry of the universe.
--The tam tam in all the movements (the darkest I've heard...Sanderling does come close though).
--The cowbells
--The flow of the Scherzo despite the upheaval in tempo...somehow it really works. Also the high piercing piccolo...wow. Gielen is great here as well.
--The andante is a showstopper...the VPO at their best. And I kinda like to hear the andante slower... :o
--The Finale actually sounds scary, and dangerious...again thanks to the VPO...what execution, they really sing this symphony through and through.
--Todd
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Todd,
I am not all that hot about Lenny's VPO version. Over the years I have repeatedly said I don't care for Lenny's rather blazing treatment of the first movt. and I'd still stick with the verdict. I am saying this because the rest of the symphony, II.-IV. are rendered very differently and in many ways 'correctly'. That is, Lenny goes after steady, heavy tempo and well balanced orchestral timber. But this is precisely what's not persued in the opening movt. The timings also suggest Lenny's inconsistent and contrasting views in the outer movts.: I - 23 min, IV. - 34 min. Even the playing by VPO is somewhat uneven and insecure in I. For these reasons, I prefer his old NYPO recording on Sony.
As for the Karajan/BPO/DG, I'd endorse III. and IV. but can't live with the first two movts. I'd have liked I. if it had been for the coda which is dashed at a break neck speed losing much of the gravitas and impact that Karajan and his players have managed to pile on up to that point. The Scherzo is not well organized and lacks focus.
Regards,
John,
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Maybe, on another thread, a member here can explain to me what is it that I am missing about Horenstein’s Mahler. I have found them all dreadfully performed. Was there not enough rehearsal time? Also, did he approve all of the releases or were many done posthumously?
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Todd,
I am not all that hot about Lenny's VPO version. Over the years I have repeatedly said I don't care for Lenny's rather blazing treatment of the first movt. and I'd still stick with the verdict. I am saying this because the rest of the symphony, II.-IV. are rendered very differently and in many ways 'correctly'. That is, Lenny goes after steady, heavy tempo and well balanced orchestral timber. But this is precisely what's not persued in the opening movt. The timings also suggest Lenny's inconsistent and contrasting views in the outer movts.: I - 23 min, IV. - 34 min. Even the playing by VPO is somewhat uneven and insecure in I. For these reasons, I prefer his old NYPO recording on Sony.
I once fell out of favor with this M6...same with the Karajan...yet upon returning after a long break I discovered that yes, I feel these accounts reveal the spirit of the M6 more than any other I've heard. And I may add...perhaps it is the nostalgia of first hearing these particular recordings when I was first discovering Mahler that draws me to them? For me, it's the trumpet cry in the development of I that keeps me returning to the Bernstein...yes, it may be somewhat over the top...but it is so powerful and dramatic I forget about everything but the music.
As for capturing the spirit of the M6...I'd also include the Haitink live LSO M6 that was never released...the most balanced M6 possibly.
As for the Karajan/BPO/DG, I'd endorse III. and IV. but can't live with the first two movts. I'd have liked I. if it had been for the coda which is dashed at a break neck speed losing much of the gravitas and impact that Karajan and his players have managed to pile on up to that point. The Scherzo is not well organized and lacks focus.
I don't mind the tempo rush at the coda in Karajan's 1st movement...it adds a false note to the heroic sounding passage that feels real to the mood of the work as a whole.
--Todd
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Mitropoulos / WDR Sinfonieorchester Köln: my favourite one, with no doubt. In my opinion, no other conductor has reached such heights of expression: I like his perforating sonorities, which I find especially fitting to this work.
Adler / Wiener Symphoniker: I still love the sound of some pioneers...
Barbirolli / New Philharmonia.
Szell / Cleveland.
Horenstein / Stockholm. This was one of the first versions of this work I ever heard, and I still remain very affectionate to it, although it seems that the other Horensteins' performance (with Bournemouth) is preferable.
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My ideal M6 used to be 1.mvt Chailly, 2&3.mvt Gielen, and 4.mvt Eschenbach (Philadelphia). Lately I have listened much to T. Sanderling. In addition there are some parts of Boulez M6, especially at the end of the 1.mvt that no other M6 matches in my opinion. My list will therefore - and for the moment - be something like:
1-3: T.Sanderling, Chailly&Gielen.
4-5: Eschenbach&Boulez.
and a runner up is Barbirolli/New Ph.
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I'm psyched about seeing this documentary. After all, how often is Mahler the focus of a movie? I was hoping a local film festival would show it this year, but that's sadly not the case.
I've mentioned it before, but even though I'm no big Berlioz fan, Zinman will do the Damnation of Faust here in April. I genuinely like Zinman, but he never does a work I like when he guest conducts. Of course, maybe if I go, he'll make me a convert.
If the music gods are listening...how about a Zinman led Mahler symphony for the SLSO 09-10 season? What do I win if I "call it?"
I don't know if I even have 5 versions of the M6, but I like both Bernstein versions and the Chailly. I have Karajan's, and there are parts I admire, but I can never get over the weird sound. I also have Bertini's, which I think is okay. I'll have to listen to it again, but my initial thoughts were you could kinda tell it was one of the early ones in his cycle. I'll have to re-evaluate that, though.
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I heartily endorse the Sanderling St Petersburg M 6. Wonderful performance, dramatic without being hysterical as Leo mentioned. A wonderful, flowing, well presented performance.
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Maybe, on another thread, a member here can explain to me what is it that I am missing about Horenstein’s Mahler. I have found them all dreadfully performed. Was there not enough rehearsal time? Also, did he approve all of the releases or were many done posthumously?
vvrinc,
you are right. The playing in all these releases of Horenstein M performances is very bad, as are the recordings. As for his music making, this considered to be somehow authentic vienesse and central-european, something that i can not thing so much.
But the journalistic( especially the british one, of course) group estimated him too high. The same as Barbiroli's Mahler, and I see with great satisfaction the opinions of David Hurwitz, who values Barbi's Mahler with scores like 2.
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Maybe, on another thread, a member here can explain to me what is it that I am missing about Horenstein’s Mahler. I have found them all dreadfully performed. Was there not enough rehearsal time? Also, did he approve all of the releases or were many done posthumously?
vvrinc,
you are right. The playing in all these releases of Horenstein M performances is very bad, as are the recordings.
Horenstein's commercial releases of M1/LSO, M4/LSO, and M9/VO are quite good though...no scrappy playing here. Yes, on some of the live M9's there are problems with the playing (yet the Music and Arts M9 is quite execellant), but listen to his live M8, where the playing is excellant. And of course his famous M3/LSO is fine as well. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder I guess ;)
--Todd
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Cleveland/Dohnanyi: probably my favourite M6, a fairly straight interpretation with superb playing and real depth to the sound. Lots of detail brought out but the whole conception is not undermined.
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I still like Boulez (DG), Fischer (Channel), and even MTT (SFS). (The M6 was what got me into classical music in the first place--it was the Leinsdorf/BSO recording, which still holds up pretty well; it is--or was--available on a good-sounding Japanese RCA CD.)
A couple of people on Audio Asylum have highly recommended the Cortese/Manhattan School of Music recording on Titanic, both for performance and sonics. Has anyone here heard it?
Russell
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Is the original Bernstein/VPO/DGG disc the same one as in the 2005 reissue as MAHLER II. The Complete Recordings on Deutsche Grammophon Vol. II. Symphonies Nos. 5-7?
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Is the original Bernstein/VPO/DGG disc the same one as in the 2005 reissue as MAHLER II. The Complete Recordings on Deutsche Grammophon Vol. II. Symphonies Nos. 5-7?
Yup :)
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I still like Boulez (DG), Fischer (Channel), and even MTT (SFS). (The M6 was what got me into classical music in the first place--it was the Leinsdorf/BSO recording, which still holds up pretty well; it is--or was--available on a good-sounding Japanese RCA CD.)
A couple of people on Audio Asylum have highly recommended the Cortese/Manhattan School of Music recording on Titanic, both for performance and sonics. Has anyone here heard it?
Russell
Thanks for the heads up on the Boulez...have to revist that one...and perhaps the MTT as well.
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Mitropoulos / WDR Sinfonieorchester Köln: my favourite one, with no doubt. In my opinion, no other conductor has reached such heights of expression: I like his perforating sonorities, which I find especially fitting to this work.
Adler / Wiener Symphoniker: I still love the sound of some pioneers...
Barbirolli / New Philharmonia.
Szell / Cleveland.
Horenstein / Stockholm. This was one of the first versions of this work I ever heard, and I still remain very affectionate to it, although it seems that the other Horensteins' performance (with Bournemouth) is preferable.
Aaaaah...forgot about the Adler! That is a great M6. I also like Horenstein/Stolkholm, and it is quite different than his Bournmouth one.
--Todd
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Having not yet heard Zinman's, so far my best Sixth are:
Bernstein CBS 1967
Leinsdorf Orfeo 1983
Sinopoli DG 1986
De Waart RCA 1994
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I dig (in no order):
Lenny/DG and Sony - caveat: I am still not a fan of the fast 1st movement
Chailly - great overall
Gielen - truly excellent - I LOVE the finale here
Boulez - weak hammerblows in Finale; the andante is pefect to my ears and the best I own
and a toss-up between the Abbado/Berliner and Haitink/Chicago
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My fav. M6 is a hybrid burn job that I put together of Nagano/DSO Berlin on the two outer movements, and Rattle/BPO on the two inner movements. I also have a burn job of an M6 "birthday" concert for Rattle, which employs both the VPO and BPO. That's fun.
Commercial recordings:
Zinman (like both of them)
Boulez/VPO (in spite of the relatively weak hammer strokes)
Eschenbach/Philly (the only one that has an andante movement that's been turned into an Adagio, that I can actually tolerate)
Mehta/Israel Phil. (Teldec)
Chailly/RCOA
T. Sanderling/St. Petersburg Phil.
If they issue the "live" Noseda/BBC Phil. one, I'll get that.
I generally like M6 recordings where the slow movement is 15 minutes or less. It's not an adagio! I have tons of other burn jobs too.
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. . . by the way, I like Abbado/BPO better when played back in S/A order, because his tempo for the scherzo perfectly matches the tempo at the end of the first movement. Conversely, I think that MTT/SFSO - a recording I'm not crazy about for a number of very specific reasons - works better when played back in A/S order (same with the Karajan).
If I recall, I think that I also enjoyed the Fischer/BFO M6 better in S/A order. Fischer has a great finale, but his first three movements are a tad "light weight".
Oh, here's another one: I like Chailly/RCOA better in A/S as well. The end of the first movement is relatively slow, and his scherzo is a tad "poopy" as well (in terms of tempi).
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. . . by the way, I like Abbado/BPO better when played back in S/A order, because his tempo for the scherzo perfectly matches the tempo at the end of the first movement. Conversely, I think that MTT/SFSO - a recording I'm not crazy about for a number of very specific reasons - works better when played back in A/S order (same with the Karajan).
If I recall, I think that I also enjoyed the Fischer/BFO M6 better in S/A order. Fischer has a great finale, but his first three movements are a tad "light weight".
Oh, here's another one: I like Chailly/RCOA better in A/S as well. The end of the first movement is relatively slow, and his scherzo is a tad "poopy" as well (in terms of tempi).
Barry, regarding the MTT/SFSO M6...it does work very well in A/S...somehow it my iTunes I have it set this way, so this is how I've been hearing this recording for awhile now.
--Todd
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Sorry to bring up an old topic again, but I am a huge M6 knut...
My favorites, in no particular order: Zander/Boston, Rattle/CBSO, Barbirolli/NPO, Bernstein/NYPO, Delfs/Milwaukee, and I like Sanderling/SPPO and Zinman/Tonhalle as well.
Barry, you mentioned having a burn job of M6 with Rattle/BPO as the middle two movements...I'm guessing you may have meant Rattle/CBSO? If not, how is the Rattle/BPO performance? I've been waiting for a BPO/Rattle M6...if the Ninth is any indicator, that should be good.
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Sorry to bring up an old topic again, but I am a huge M6 knut...
My favorites, in no particular order: Zander/Boston, Rattle/CBSO, Barbirolli/NPO, Bernstein/NYPO, Delfs/Milwaukee, and I like Sanderling/SPPO and Zinman/Tonhalle as well.
Barry, you mentioned having a burn job of M6 with Rattle/BPO as the middle two movements...I'm guessing you may have meant Rattle/CBSO? If not, how is the Rattle/BPO performance? I've been waiting for a BPO/Rattle M6...if the Ninth is any indicator, that should be good.
Michael,
There was indeed a Rattle/BPO M6 officially released in 1987 I think, not in the states, but in Europe or Japan if I'm not mistaken. I have a burn job of this performance and wrote my thoughts some time ago...here they are:
(http://www.jpc.de/image/cover/front/0/7558515.jpg)
This a very ravishing performance. Dark, but full of inner light like a Rembrandt painting. The BPO play certain parts of the first movement like no other...somehow they bring an 'icey glow" to many of the woodwind passages. This first movement also sounds very large, like an overwhelming view off a mountain. During the andante Rattle phrases certain lines in a way I haven't heard before, but his choices work rather well. The same goes for the frantically played Scherzo here, which is played very fast, only catching it's breath in the contrasting Trio sections...alot of color is displayed here, and thereby much character is expressed. The tempo choices, whether delibrately slowed down or sped up, take the breath away and are very exciting. I'd say the Scherzo is a highlight. As heard in the previous movements, the Finale delivers the various textures of the orchestration with invigorating character. Rattle really emphasizes the 'modern' aspects of the orchestration. In contrast to the phrase modeling and tempo distruptions of the previous movements, the Finale appears to be played more 'straight', which works rather well for the dramatic arc of the performance...it certainly doesn't drag at any point, which is easy to do in this Finale, with all it's various sections. The duration of the whole Finale (28 minutes) is also faster than I'm used to, but actually works to bring balance to the first movement...this is a good solution in regards to the issue of balance in this work. The speed emphasizes how unsentimental this interpetation is, especially during the final measures...therefore it is rather bleak in outlook.
--Todd
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Hi Todd, since we're online simul.
Have a lot of catching-up to do. Can afford to start getting more 6ths. I've not heard so many.
So far, I also go strongly with the Mitropoulos/Stuttgart, with its tremendous expressiveness, and rubato.
And I have an abiding affection for two of the oldsters that I grew up with - adler and Flipse..
E.G. in The Gramophone remarked on the hushed dramatic pause in the Adler before the final pizz.
Horenstein so often gets it right for me.
Iivor
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Wouldn't mind hearing the Mitropoulos but unless I am missing something somewhere it is only available as part of a $70+ box set.
Any idea when the Schwarz will be on iTunes/Napster/Amazon MP3? I look forward to hearing it.
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OK, here is my list of top 5:
1. Levi/ASO/Telarc (great playing & sound, a lot similar to Lenny's old recording)
2. Lenny/NYPO/CBS (still a classic)
3. Zinman/TOZ/RCA (the best AS order. very musical but also finely consistent throughout)
4. Eschenbach/PO/Ondine (the best SA version in modern sound, along with the Levi)
5. Tennstedt/LPO/EMI (live. the wildest, craziest, yet curiously moving account)
John,
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Here are my updated top 5...MTT and Zinman are new to this list!
Bernstein/VPO (Japanese SHM CD preferred)
MTT/SFSO
Karajan/BPO
Bertini/KOLN
Zinman/TOZ
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The Mitro. I got as part of a 2-CD set from EMI.
Ivor
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Since we're at least mentioning the Bernstein/NYPO...any idea what that shout is somewhere in the middle-near the end of the finale? It comes when the desperate march reappears for the last time, fast and furious. It sounds like someone (Lenny?) shouts "Waight!" but I'm not sure.
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James Levine / LSO on RCA. Terrifyingly terrific!
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James Levine / LSO on RCA. Terrifyingly terrific!
Agreed. A quite athletic and even balletic view of the Mahler Sixth. Great playing and sound (recorded by Bob Auger?).
John,
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Great playing and sound (recorded by Bob Auger?)
Yes, by Bob Auger and Paul Goodman, with producer David Saks.
James
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Bob Auger did a great job of engineering Horenstein's two Mahler recordings for Unicorn, M1st and M3rd. I always liked the sound he created, natural, concert hall sounding, with an excellent sonic perspective. What else did he record?
John,
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Bob Auger did a great job of engineering Horenstein's two Mahler recordings for Unicorn, M1st and M3rd. I always liked the sound he created, natural, concert hall sounding, with an excellent sonic perspective. What else did he record?
Bob Auger also did the Nielsen 5 for Unicorn. He learned his craft by assisting Robert Fine of Mercury Records. His first "solo" commercial recording was Barbirolli's RVW 8 in 1956. He was one of the earliest "freelancers" and was used by a number of companies over the years, including PYE and RCA. He also did some pop work. There must be a discography somewhere on the internet. He died in 1998.
James
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I have the Nielsen 5th on Unicorn. It sounds great and is an excellent N5th by all accounts. The snare drum in I. is something to die for!! :o :D. I think it was him who, after Horenstein died, sought after Horenstein archives word wide and got several of them released including a M6th with Stockholm Ph. O. I still love the recording for what it is worth.
John,
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I have the Nielsen 5th on Unicorn. The snare drum in I. is something to die for!!
Yes, it's the best Nielsen 5 side drum solo I've ever heard, even though he (Alfred Dukes) enters a measure early, stops, and then comes back in at the proper time. There was both a producer (Antony Hodgson) and a musical supervisor (composer Robert Simpson) in place on this project—it's hard to believe neither of them caught his mistake.
James
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I'll try to get this thread at least halfway back on track by stating what is to me, the one M6 that would sit at the BOTTOM of my heap, and that is the EMI/Angel recording by (I'm sorry to say, considering how great a conductor he was and whom I admired) Barbirolli. I've never heard a first movement plod along like his does. I think there is a BBC Legends recording of him doing the same work. If so, is that any better?
Wade
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I don't know if it's better, but the tempi are - indeed - faster on his "live" recording. Just as an f.y.i., it's been issued on the expensive Testament label, and not on BBC Legends. What's interesting to me is that Barbirolli starts each of the first three movements at tempi that fairly close to those on his EMI studio recording, then speeds up somewhere along the way. I think that the "live" one is a somewhat better performance, but the studio one definitely sounds better.
Barry
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Yes Barry, I agree with the better sonics of the studio recording.
And I feel Barbirolli's sixth is one of those special-case recordings; I would love to know his reasoning for the tempo in the first movement. There are times when I listen to it and I really like the idea, but other times when I really want to be getting on with the work.
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And I feel Barbirolli's sixth is one of those special-case recordings; I would love to know his reasoning for the tempo in the first movement. There are times when I listen to it and I really like the idea, but other times when I really want to be getting on with the work.
Precisely. That's how I feel about the Barbirolli. I can't live without it, can't live it with it.
Another M6th that is growing on me is Ben Zander/PO/Telarc. I know this recording has not been a favorite among critics but I like the deep sound (not the playing) that Telarc provided for this one. Also, Zander has a few interesting points to make, e.g., in the Scherzo and Andante movts. It comes with his extensive lecture on the piece too.
John,
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... AND let's not forget Gielen's powerfully expressionistic account on Hanssler. It's slow in the opening movt. but never feels slow thanks to Gielen's full-blown, powerful reading from start to finish. The Scherzo is also outstanding with menacing brass and whopping woodwinds where Gielen's delineation of polyphonic really shines through. It may be the best M6 Scherzo along with Rattle's and Bernstein's.
John,
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Since this is, for me, THE mahler symphony, I'm thrilled the thread is so popular.
Ivor
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Since this is, for me, THE mahler symphony, I'm thrilled the thread is so popular.
Ivor
Though M2 is the one for me (and the one most meaningful, from a spiritual standpoint), I feel that M6 is probably his best orchestrated symphony, even if Mahler breaks with his standard of multi-movements and reverts to classical form. I also feel that most orchestras take the work as a real challenge to their mettle, and the recorded output shows it.
Wade
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Another M6th that is growing on me is Ben Zander/PO/Telarc. I know this recording has not been a favorite among critics but I like the deep sound (not the playing) that Telarc provided for this one. Also, Zander has a few interesting points to make, e.g., in the Scherzo and Andante movts. It comes with his extensive lecture on the piece too.
John,
I too like the Ben Zander Mahler 6, although if asked to choose I would take his Boston Philharmonic recording over the Philharmonia Orchestra. The playing isn't as good as on the Telarc release, but (1) it's a live performance, (2) the orchestra really stretches itself and does well, and (3) the hammer blows are three of the best I've heard. Although, in the hammer blow department, Andreas Delfs and the Milwaukee Symphony comes close.
Yes, Gielen's M6 is a grinding but forward-moving account. The first movement has the heavyness of Barbirolli but yet the forward movement of Sanderling.
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Ditto here. I prefer Zander's earlier BPO version over the PO one since it has a better overall shape and more involvement from the players. I was one of the few who were lucky to get Mr. Zander's autograph on the CD cover (he and I were living in Boston at that time and we chatted over the phone one day). I really like the Gielen too. The instrumental colors and timbre that he elicits from the orchestra are amazing and all help to give strength and power to the performance. Along with M3rd and M7th, it's the best in his Mahler cycle.
John,
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... and (3) the hammer blows are three of the best I've heard. Although, in the hammer blow department, Andreas Delfs and the Milwaukee Symphony comes close....
Michael, can you tell us more about the MSO/Delfs recording? I see from their web site that the order is S/A. What are timings of the movements? Two or three hammers? If it is live performance recording, how behaved was the audience? How is the balance between the sections? Appreciate your thoughts, Russ
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... and (3) the hammer blows are three of the best I've heard. Although, in the hammer blow department, Andreas Delfs and the Milwaukee Symphony comes close....
Michael, can you tell us more about the MSO/Delfs recording? I see from their web site that the order is S/A. What are timings of the movements? Two or three hammers? If it is live performance recording, how behaved was the audience? How is the balance between the sections? Appreciate your thoughts, Russ
Where is this recording available??
I can't find any place (including MSO's website) that describes/promotes/sells this one.
John,
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John,
Only available as mp3 through the MSO website (cheapest - $4.99):
http://download.mso.org/app?page=Product&service=external&sp=S0A05065B0EXUUQ3BZ0034
or itunes. Timings (S/A):
I. 22:59
II. 12:14
III. 17:42
IV. 28:40
Best,
Steele
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Thank you, Steele.
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Thanks, but no thanks.
I don't like the sound of MP3 files :-\.
John,
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Well...looks like I checked this thread a little late. But here are my thoughts:
First, the important stuff: S/A, and three great hammers. A real smashing success, I'd say. ;-) The audience is well-behaved; you can definitely hear the audience, but not in a bad way. It only serves to remind the listener that this is a live performance.
The timing of the Andante seems a bit long, (well, actually, really long now that I think about it) but the one time I listened to this performance in its entirety from start to finish, the Andante did not seem to drag. That may be because I am less familiar with the two inner movements than the outer two (mainly the Finale), but I tend to think that the slower--presumably more clingy and emotional--approach is what got me hooked.
I know there are those who are not fans of MP3 songs, and when it's lower than 256 KB/Sec I tend to agree. In all of my audio recordings (I make sound recordings of trains), I archive the originals in .wav and keep the edited stuff in 256 KB/S MP3...can't take it any lower without selling out on audio quality.
I guess what I am trying to say is that MP3, or in this case, M4A, sound at the format they're selling it at on iTunes--256 KB/S--sounds no different from a CD to me. I have no idea how high of quality the MSO is selling the album at, but I would suspect again 256 KB/S or higher, which would mean that the compression is not noticeable--for me at least.
All in all...I'd say it's definitely a keeper. True, the three great hammers are what sold me on this one--I heard it on Napster's unlimited listening service and then went to buy it on iTunes--but there is a lot to be said for the live concert atmosphere that is reproduced in this recording.
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Once again, I'll protest that 17:42 is completely wrong for the slow movement. That movement, regardless of where you place it, is marked Andante Moderato, and there isn't even one single mention of the word "langsam" (slow) anywhere in the entire movement. It simply is not an adagio. Further more, it makes no sense to me that one would want to do the scherzo relatively fast, then take the slow movement at a crawl, only to be followed by a fairly fast finale. I'll bet anything that this performance might sound more coherent with the middle two movements switched, given the timings.
Barry
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I'm doing a revisit on Philharmonia Orchestra, Giuseppe Sinopoli......crickey's this is good! Wow.
He had me from the opening staccato notes! Is it me or do I hear details that I don't hear in other versions?
Is this reading considered a "classic" M6?
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I'm doing a revisit on Philharmonia Orchestra, Giuseppe Sinopoli......crickey's this is good! Wow.
He had me from the opening staccato notes! Is it me or do I hear details that I don't hear in other versions?
Is this reading considered a "classic" M6?
I love this recording! Thanks for reminding me of it!
I particularly enjoy the tempo of Alma's theme in all it's appearances in the first movement. It's just right. I always felt this theme should take it's time.
This is the only symphony from Sinopoli's cycle I've heard.
--Todd
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Too much fun this! You've sent me back into a recurring (every two-years or so) Mahler Sixth bacchanalia. The real challenge was keeping it to commercial recordings!! AAGGH! Like cooking with one hand tied behind one's back. Gotta do a no-holds-barred list sometime, maybe it will start a file-sharing frenzy :o
Mitropoulos/Köln RSO (EMI 2-CD set GREAT CONDUCTORS OF THE 20TH CENTURY: DIMITRI MITROPOULOS, 1959 rec.) I find myself listening to this one more intently than his 1955 NYPO recording although both, or either, are just essential Mahler.
Mackerras/BBC SO (BBC Music Cover CD, 2002 recording): a whole bunch of details came clear with the way Mackerras lets the textures shine. It's a sleeper, given that it came as a freebie with the mag!
Kubelik/Bavarian RSO (Audite, live 1968 rec.) I prefer Kubelik's way with the M6 of the fleet-footed accounts, though the Bernstein/NYPO is a close runner-up. Lenny's gargantuan neon emotional signage distracts me out of the listening sometimes- "CRY NOOOOW!! FEEEEEEL THIS!!! Whereas a bit of the relative subtlety Rafael uses keeps my hatred of manipulation in check...
Thomas Sanderling/St. Petersburg PO (RS, 1995 rec.) There's been alot said about this one by everyone here and elsewhere, justifiably so. This is an exemplary recording of a performance that manages the tightrope between palpably -but barely- restrained emotional breakdown and formal cohesiveness.
Horenstein/Bournemouth SO (BBC Legends, 1969 rec.) Despite the lacklustre sound, this is as close to a Furtwangler M6 I'll get. It has all that frisson and delivers the patented Horenstein sonic meltdowns, large and small. Also common to all of this conductor's Mahler is that satisfying feeling that no one is on autopilot at any time.
No numbering, ask me tommorrow and upon revisit the whole list is liable to be different. Come to think of it, that's how Maestro Gustav rolls, too. :P
Guillermo
http://statework.blogspot.com
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Let's have an all-out list...I'm all for an M6 file-sharing frenzy! ;-)
I really like the Chailly/RCOA...reminds me a lot of the Barbirolli, especially in the first and last movements. The Rattle/CBSO is great too, as are both Bernsteins. I like the more natural sound of the NYPO Bernstein recording, though, but as I said both of his recordings are classics. Don't forget the Zander/Philharmonia and of course the Zander/Boston Phil. I'm going to listen to some of the M6's on Mahler150.com to see if I can find anything else there I like. Oh, yeah, the Levine/BSO M6 is good too...nice, natural sound with three hammers to boot.
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Musn't forget the T.Sanderling...that too is another M6 great.
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Someone should buy the rights to the T. Sanderling M6, and reissue it.
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Stateworkers:"Mackerras/BBC SO (BBC Music Cover CD, 2002 recording): a whole bunch of details came clear with the way Mackerras lets the textures shine. It's a sleeper, given that it came as a freebie with the mag!"
My library has this - I may check it out at your recommendation. Thanks.
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Go listen to that Mackerras if you can...it's a great one. The music sweeps you away in the first movement and doesn't let you go...it's wonderful.
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Even though I'm completely opposed to reinstating the 3rd hammer stroke, yes, the MacKerras M6 is very good.
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Even though I'm completely opposed to reinstating the 3rd hammer stroke, yes, the MacKerras M6 is very good.
Where is it?
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Twenty-seven minutes into the 4th movement right where it is on page 260 of the Dover score, 10 bars after rehearsal 164.
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I think the hammers in the Mackerras are a bit weak but the energy and intensity of the performance--combined with the fact that there are in fact three hammers--makes up for it. This is a real "live" recording and I have great appreciation for that.