Gergiev/LSO M8

[barry guerrero]

I've received an advance, promotional copy of the Gergiev Mahler 8. It's interesting, and not all unsuccessful, considering that Gergiev had to hold everybody together in the unbelievably "boomy" acoustics of St. Paul's Cathedral. Unison passages, such the big "block" choral passages in Part 1, aren't such a problem. Instead, ensemble work comes a little loose during the swifter and lightly scored, somewhat Mendelssohn-like passages in Part II (such as after the childrens chorus' first entrance in Part II). But to compensate for that, the childrens chorus is excellent; the best I've ever heard in any M8 (and I think they get reinforced here and there by women's voices). Just to cite one example, you can really pick out the childrens chorus through all that dense polyphony near the end of Part 1. The mostly slavic cast of soloists is fairly successful too.

On the whole, the women are better than the men. The tenor is OK, but not the very best either (I like Johan Botha on the Boulez). But at least he doesn't sound strained on his top notes. One strange thing is that the bass-baritone has a brighter timbre to his voice than the regular baritone. As you might expect, the organ is "kick-butt" throughout. If Boulez had too little organ at the end of his Part II, Gergiev has all the organ anybody could ever hope for. Unfortunately, the offstage brass are too distant to have any effect on the recording. I'm sure that if one had been seated near where the offstage brass were placed, you'd probably hear too much of them.  But considering, there's really little to complain about here. My own personal-prefernce complaint is the same one that I almost always have: Gergiev is simply too swift with the very, very end of the symphony (where the simultaneous cymbal/tam-tam smashes are located). But at least there's tons of organ, and the "hang-time" after the final chord - after both parts, really - has to be heard to be believed! That alone makes it fun.

Keep Boulez for clarity within a good acoustic, as well as decent singing (the tenor is great). Keep Bertini for his great tempo relationships and unbelievable ending (super slow with great tam-tam smashes). Keep whatever your favorite Mahler 8 is. Add Gergiev if you want a great childrens chorus (for once) and tons of organ, caught in "one-off" event at a huge cathedral. And yes, it fits on one disc.

By the way, I sampled sections of the new Ivan Fischer M4 on Channel Classics, and it really sounds great. More on that later this week.

Barry

[Leo K]

Thanks Barry for the preview!  Can't wait to hear this.

 

--Todd

[barry guerrero]

Don't get your hopes up too high. But it is different enough that it's worth listening to at least one or two times. I've really been enjoying it, in spite of its obvious drawbacks.

[sperlsco]

Unfortunately, the offstage brass are too distant to have any effect on the recording. I'm sure that if one had been seated near where the offstage brass were placed, you'd probably hear too much of them.  Barry

I wonder if the multi-channel SACD will help in this regard.  I know that the Nagano SACD has the offstage brass placed in the rear speakers, which I feel is a fabulous use of the technology.  I think that the Chailly DVD-A may do the same thing. 

[barry guerrero]

As you know, I don't have the Yamaha multi-format player hooked up to any surround sound equipment. But the 2 channel sacd layer sounds totally different than the regular cd layer. I actually suspect that they used the BBC mikes (BBC3 broadcast) for the regular cd portion, while James Mallinson's outfit dealt with just the sacd portion. The balances are totally different. On the sacd layer, the offstage brass are closer - as are the singers - but the organ is more distant. You see, in St. Paul's Cathedral, I'm pretty certain that the organ is a good ways away from where the orchestra is. I actually think that the BBC mikes might have been farther back than Mallinson's mikes were. Listen to both, and tell me if you think I'm off base on this. To be honest, I greatly prefer how it sounds on the plain-old cd layer. The "hang time" after both parts seems much longer on the regular cd layer as well.

On the whole, the sacd layer sounded better balanced and more musical. But it also sounded more cautious, and with far less organ in the mix. The plain cd side sounds more aggressive and more "boomy", with less worry about balances, etc. The sacd layer is Stravinsky; the cd layer is Bruckner (or religion for Mahlerites).

Barry

[sperlsco]

I actually suspect that they used the BBC mikes (BBC3 broadcast) for the regular cd portion, ...

Barry

It's funny you mention that.  I listened to the BBC broadcast last week (via an Operashare download), and it sounded exactly as you described it in your first post.  The offstage trumpets at the end of Part 1 were completely absent.  They were slightly better at the end of Part 2. 

I was thinking of holding off on purchasing any of the SACD's from this cycle and making do with the MP3's from eMusic, pending the probablity that the cycle will be released as an SACD budget box set.  However, the BBC broadcast makes me long for the multi-channel SACD!  I'll probably place an order with MDT this week. 

BTW, I found the Gergiev M2 and M6 SACD's at my local library branch of all places.  I would be less surprised to find them at the main downtown branch (which has a rather large classical CD collection), but my local suburban branch had 2 new(ish) Mahler CD's among their 50 total classical ones. 

[sperlsco]

I received the Gergiev M8 on Good Friday, so I had to cancel my regularly scheduled Easter-weekend tour of M2's.  I was able to listen to the performance twice, but unfortunately with many interruptions.  This is truly a thrilling interpretation.  The multi-channel sound adds quite a bit to the experience.  The organ is HUGE, and comes from all around you.  The majority of the sound comes from the front three speakers, except when the organ comes in -- and when it does -- WOW!.  The offstage brass are indeed located in the rear left speakers, as is the Mater Gloriosa -- this is an excellent use of surround technology.  The pace of the ending of Part II is a little fast for my taste, but it is a thrilling ending nonetheless, given all of the organ, the clarity of the brass, the huge cymbal crashes (with adequate support form the tam-tam -- especially on the last smash), and the offstage brass actually coming from another location in my room!  The end of Part 1 is also thrilling beyond belief (and again, offstage brass from the left-rear speaker).  I am not in love with the soloists, but they are all competent (unlike Davis and Nagano on SACD, where the Gretchen sopranos are simply awful).  I agree that the children's chorus is quite noticeable and noteworthy (I generally never give them a second thought).  The LSO brass and percussion are quite exceptional throughout.  There are a few times that Gergiev's swift tempos are not to my liking and a few details may be missing, but this is true of any performance. 

All in all, I give this recording a strong recommendation. 

[John Kim]

Scott,

Thanks for your report. It really intrigues me....might as well get the disc sometime ... just for the huge organ

John,

[Russ Smiley]

I've listened to this CD twice with only the PC's remote speakers.  My prior experiences have been with Jarvi, Chailly, Bertini, and Wit: I disliked the first two and thought the latter two were exemplary.

I think this recording is exciting start to finish.  The opening organ is magnificent.  The deep hall is very apparent at the start and finish (the echo at the conclusion must be over 6 seconds in length), but much less so in the middle movements..  I suspect the engineers had put extra effort into unobtrusively adjusting balances for this recording.  Soloists here are all fine with tenor Sergey Semishkur really inspiring as Doctor Marianus.  The children's choir is clear and prominent: I imagine they enjoyed themselves and the same impression goes for the adult choirs.  The tempos all worked well for me: my attention never wandered in the middle as sometimes happened with other recordings.  The orchestra sounded great: in their M6 I found annoying sounds coming from the winds (I recall a very breathy clarinet passage), but there's none of that here.

I envy those of you with SACD equipment.

[John Kim]

Russ,

Thanks for the report.

I am not normally hot on M8th but it sounds like this could be a good investment  .

My favoriates are Horenstein, Bernstein (Sony), Bertini, and Chailly.

Regards,

John,

[barry guerrero]

"I envy those of you with SACD equipment"

I do, and I think that the normal CD side sounds better. Both "sides" sound as though they come from completely different microphone locations. I far prefer the balances and overall "blending" on the CD side. In other words, don't sweat the absence of an sacd player in your home. That said, I don't have 5.1 surround sound equipment though.

Barry

[sperlsco]

As you know, I don't have the Yamaha multi-format player hooked up to any surround sound equipment. But the 2 channel sacd layer sounds totally different than the regular cd layer.
Barry

Hey Barry, just a throught here:

Check the default settings on the Yamaha player.  Make certain that the player is not defaulting to the multi-channel SACD tracks.  If it is, you would be getting just 2.0 of the 5.0 channels that are encoded (FWIW, the booklet states 5.0 channels, but I cannot hear anything concrete coming out of the center channel), which would really change the sonics for the worse.  While anything is possible, I would be shocked if the CD and SACD stereo layers were different mixes.   

I'm listening to the multi-channel mix (again) as I type.  I'm liking this performance as much as any of my other favorites at this point. 

[barry guerrero]

Thanks, I'll be sure to do that    .     .     .     if I can figure out how   

Barry "techno-boob" Guerrero

[John Kim]

Today I got the Gergiev/LSO/LSO M8th SACD for just $10.99 at Silver Platter .

I'll give a listen soon.

John,