Solti/CSO/Decca M9th - revisit

[John Kim]

It's been some time since I listened to Solti's second recording with CSO. As you all know, critics put all the harsh words when it was first released. But in retrospect I think this is as fine a recording as any that came out at that time and since. Objectively, I can't find any fault with Solti's reading, nor with the playing of CSO. Solti has nearly perfect tempo and tempo relationships in all four movts. The outer movts are particularly expansive but thanks to Solti's skillful gear changes and subtle control in dynamics and phrasing, they never feel being dragged excessively. The two inner movts are equally impressive with hefty execution of the Landler and waltz sections as well as the fast passages in RB. Overall, the orchestral balance is superb with the Chicago brass justly on top of everything. But the strings and woodwinds are also strong throughout. Perhaps the only cirticism I can make is Decca's overly bright and analytic sound that tends to lighten things up in a piece that doesn't necessarily needs such a treatment. What I did was to tame the brightness by adjusting treble level and it helped dampen the sound greatly. I will try to make an analogue duplication on a cassette tape.

As much I like Solti's London recording, I'd like to endorse a high praise for this Mahler Ninth.

John,

[Leo K]

Thanks for your thoughts on this recording John...if I see it used I will certainly grab it.  I recently bought Solti's LSO M9 and hear that is pretty good.

--Todd

[barry guerrero]

It's quite good - one of Solti's better Chicago Mahler recordings. However, as John indicates, the sound quality is less than ideal. Interpretively speaking, compared to earlier LSO M9, it's a bit of a Karajan clone-job too. I wouldn't put it up there with the best ones.

B.

[john haueisen]

FYI:  Amazon.com's used sellers have new copies of the Decca M9 CSO/Solti for $12.82 + 2.98 shipping.

[Dave H]

I think Solti's LSO Ninth is vastly superior to the Chicago remake, relistening doesn't change my opinion. It's not the just that the harsh, overly bright sound is bad in the latter. Solti had the remarkable ability to be loud and crude without ever being exciting as well. Moments such as the big climax of the first movement, the fast waltz in the second, and much of the Rondo:Burleske are fast and noisy, but also lacking in impact and focus in terms of balance and rhythm. Of course the playing as such is very fine for the most part, but with all due respect to John, the calibre of major orchestras today is so high that most play big, complex works extremely well. How much credit should go to the conductor, and who much would the orchestra have done anyway, for anyone?

I think conductors today get far too much credit for the excellent training and professionalism of the players, and I say this after several decades of orchestral playing. For me, the key question is what unique or significant insights does the conductor bring to the table--and I don't mean those little differences that invariably distinguish one performance from the next. In my view the answer here is "not many." I happened to see Solti and Chicago perform the symphony live around the same time as the recording was made--it was one of the most disappointing concerts I have ever attended, and to that extent the recording certainly is better, but hardly among the finest out there. For the record, here are three "sleeper" Mahler Ninths that I think are extremely, even unexpectedly excellent, and which have some very special moments that you won't find anywhere else (and all are demonstrably more interesting that Solit/Chicago):

Pesek/Royal Liverpool Philharmonic (Virgin)
Ozawa/Boston (Philips)
Masur/NYPO (Teldec)

Best,

Dave H

[John Kim]

Good points, Dave.

It's hard to tell, but whether it's the sound quality or the conductor I sometimes (but not every time I listen) get similar impression of this recording. For instance, at the final climax of I. the Chicago brass blow themselves out way too much. Sure, the score ask for the greatest power, but it should be in the quality not just in the loudness. There are a few other places like that, but overall I think it is a very solid reading in every aspect and I'd attribute whatever the downsides more to the sonics.

As for your three recommendations, I wholeheartedly agree with the Ozawa. But I might have slight reservations about the other two. Pesek's is really and unexpectedly fine, sometimes great, but I find the playing of the orchestra somewhat uneven; the brass are outstanding throughout while the woodwinds, especially solo playing, is often below the par. Here again, it is partly due to the sound which is way too close and tends to reveal too many details including the imperfect ensemble of the orchestra.

The Masur is also very fine but I can't really get over with its fast tempo in I.  My current picks are (if I have to limit to only three),

Macal/CPO/Exton
Ozawa/BSO/Philips
Svetlanov/het Residentie Orkest (has anyone heard this one?)

Best,

John,

[barry guerrero]

Svetlanov/het Residentie Orkest (has anyone heard this one?)

hey John. I thought you were aware that I own a copy of the Svetlanov M9. For you folks who haven't heard this, it's a relatively fast performance - something like a Kubelik M9, for example - but with an incredibly fast and tightly played Rondo-Burlesque (less than 11 minutes in duration). Indeed, it's pretty good in its own weird way.

Barry

[Leo K]

John,

I believe I have the Svetlanov M9 as well...I haven't heard this yet, but I shall listen soon!

--Todd

[Michael]

With Mahler150.com offering several interpretations of each Mahler work I am like a kid in a candy store here.  ;-)  Anyway, I am currently listening to the Finale of the Solti/CSO M9.  I have only listened to parts of all four movements, but what I heard I generally liked.  The two areas of concern though are the sound--I wish the orchestra had been recorded closer up) and the vibrato in the violins.  It is very noticeable in the opening pages of the first movement and again in some of the solo passages in the Finale.  The vibrato sounds too hiper for my tastes.
But I really like Solti's treatment of the Finale.  The French Horn really sings out its two noble melodies, and the climax is slow and intense, and it really makes an impact.  Good stuff!

[nickmolland]

Funnily enough, I just listened tothis again too. 'Graceless' was the word that came to mind. On the other hand, I've always enjoed the Pesek, and I've just bought the Masur and Ozawa, so I'm interested to see what I make of them!

I really enjoyed Judd's account recently as well.

Nick