Top Ten

[Paul Candy]

Hi PT,

The Maderna is one of my current favorites along with Sinopoli's Dresden 9. Can't think of two more different performances. Maderna's is surprisingly warm, passionate, even wild with, I think, terrific playing from the BBCSO. Given Maderna's history, I was expecting a fairly detached and maybe a little colder vibe but it sure ain't that. I can see lots of folks here taking issue with some of Maderna's tempos especially in the last movement when he puts the brakes on for a few seconds. But certainly one of the most interesting and for me enjoyable Mahler 9's around. And considering the age and that this is a live performance, I quite like the sound quality--up front, good dynamics, full, rich sounding if a little coarse here and there. Personally, I'd take this 9th over that of Chailly, for example, and several others who might offer the most technically accurate of readings but frankly bore me to no end. With Mahler, especially the 9th, I should feel something. Maybe not a first choice if coming to this symphony for the first time but worth having in my opinion.

The Sinopoli is far broader and I believe one of the longest on record but as others have noted, it doesn't seem that way. Sinopoli is a hit and miss conductor for me but strikes gold here. I suspect that is partly due to the Staatskapelle Dresden were perfectly in sync with his vision. Sometimes you can hear a conductor trying to get his vision or whatever you want to call it (hey, I'm no musician) across but the orchestra is simply not up to it. You may not like this particular interpretation but like the Maderna you can't deny that the execution is pretty good.

Just my 2 cents

cheers
paul

[Leo K]

Thanks for your thoughts Paul...very helpful.

--Todd

[barry guerrero]

Paul,

I certainly share your enthusiasm for Sinopoli's Dresden M9 (and for the same reasons). Unfortunately, what worked rather well in the 9th symphony, makes the 4th symphony a difficult listen. I'm afraid I can't endorse his Dresden M4 without a warning sticker (I'll post separately about that). It's one of the most self-indulgent performances of anything I've ever heard. Too bad, because the playing is predictably gorgeous.

As for the Maderna M9, it certainly had its own brand of personality. I don't remember it so well, and listened to it only before passing it on to John Kim. But I really wasn't all that taken with it. Frankly, I really like the Chailly one. I like the unusual way he spins himself out of the second movement's, third and final waltz section; making for an interesting transition back into the final Laendler passage (Tempo I, in other words). That was memorable, along with the generally excellent playing of the Concertgebouw (terrific woodwinds!).

Barry

[Polarius T]

Hi PT,

The Maderna is one of my current favorites along with Sinopoli's Dresden 9. Can't think of two more different performances. Maderna's is surprisingly warm, passionate, even wild with, I think, terrific playing from the BBCSO. Given Maderna's history, I was expecting a fairly detached and maybe a little colder vibe but it sure ain't that. I can see lots of folks here taking issue with some of Maderna's tempos especially in the last movement when he puts the brakes on for a few seconds. But certainly one of the most interesting and for me enjoyable Mahler 9's around. And considering the age and that this is a live performance, I quite like the sound quality--up front, good dynamics, full, rich sounding if a little coarse here and there. Personally, I'd take this 9th over that of Chailly, for example, and several others who might offer the most technically accurate of readings but frankly bore me to no end. With Mahler, especially the 9th, I should feel something. Maybe not a first choice if coming to this symphony for the first time but worth having in my opinion.

The Sinopoli is far broader and I believe one of the longest on record but as others have noted, it doesn't seem that way. Sinopoli is a hit and miss conductor for me but strikes gold here. I suspect that is partly due to the Staatskapelle Dresden were perfectly in sync with his vision. Sometimes you can hear a conductor trying to get his vision or whatever you want to call it (hey, I'm no musician) across but the orchestra is simply not up to it. You may not like this particular interpretation but like the Maderna you can't deny that the execution is pretty good.

Just my 2 cents

cheers
paul

Paul,

The way I hear the Maderna recording very much parallels the way you put it here, as regards both the performance and the sound. I find it absorbing like very few, if any, others; it literally keeps me at the edge of my seat, listening attentively and nodding my head all the time (those liberties he takes with pauses, for instance, I find utterly undistracting; rather the opposite, after you've heard them once).

AND incidentally, the way I've been listening to this disc lately is precisely...in tandem with the Sinopoli, which I am quite impressed by as well. Funny you should be finding the same cohesion somewhere there, too. Another funny thing is, the difference between the two conductors (or at least the difference in expectations regarding them) that you bring up is sort of reversed in their renditions of this work: the at times ultraromantic Sinopoli comes across like a stubborn experimental investigation based on a relatively cool consideration of a clinical case, and the oft-ultrarational Maderna moves you down to your bone marrow. Such is the mystery of music!

And I agree not everything done by Sinopoli fits the description; some stuff he's done can appear pretty vague or alternatively forced and sometimes I've found him a bit too subjective-sounding for my tastes (in some of his DG Mahler series, for instance). His personal enthusiasm about the works he performed and his seriousness of purpose are never in doubt, however.

-PT

[Leo K]

Interesting list indeed. There is only one performance there that might make my "top ten" list--Bernstein/Concertgebouw, and several that I regard as just plain horrible. Here, if anyone cares, is my top 12 list (couldn't limit it to just 10):

Ancerl (Supraphon--amazingly urgent and characterful, with the Czech Phil in top form)
Bernstein (Sony or DG--the "let it all hang out" choices)
Chailly (Decca--simply stunning playing by any definition, and an intensely lyrical interpretation)
Pesek (Virgin--a real sleeper--full of good ideas and surprisingly well played by the Liverpool orch.)
Solti/LSO (Decca--not being Solti fan, this is really special, sumptuous and kind of Straussian, but it works)
Karajan II (DG--one of his greatest recordings of anything)
Ozawa (Philips--perhaps the most perfectly played performance on disc; the live concert was one of the most astonishing things I have ever seen)
Masur (Teldec--really interesting conception--slightly underplayed first movement but unusually weighty finale)
Levine/Philly (RCA--Barry hates that slow finale but I think they sustain it well)
Bertini/Cologne (EMI--and speaking of slow finales)
Haitink/Concertgebouw (Philips--vintage Concertgebouw before they started sounding like everyone else)
Sanderling (Berlin Classics--much better than his draggy Erato recording, a nicely grim and determined Germanic reading)

The Ninth has been very lucky on disc, but then it also seems to be one of those pieces that somehow "plays itself," at least to the extent that the music is so affecting that it hardly fails to make a strong impression--unless the conductor is more interested in himself than in the music (Rattle), or is simply cloddish and incompetent (Horenstein). Sorry folks--I know that's shooting a sacred cow or two, but there it is. Chacun a son gout! 

Dave H

Dave, I just found a copy of the Pesek M9 at the used shop...I notice it's on your list here, so thanks for the recommendation...I'm really looking forward to hearing this!

--Todd

[Leo K]

Oh, and John K, I noticed you mentioned the Solti/LSO/Decca M9 recently, I'm going to listen to that as well for the first time. 

--Todd