Author Topic: introducing Mahler to new listeners  (Read 24690 times)

john haueisen

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #15 on: June 13, 2011, 09:35:54 PM »
I agree with Wade, in congratulating Herb that he was able to get "several" people together at the same time who are willing to be introduced to Mahler.

Does anyone have a suggestion for Herb as to a couple of "opening lines"--some quick explanation of Mahler or the characteristics of M2 that might pique their interest and put them in a receptive mood to meet their first experience with Mahler?

Offline barry guerrero

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #16 on: June 13, 2011, 11:56:45 PM »
How 'bout, "fasten your seatbelts"?

Emphasize that it's an all inclusive, more 'humanist' view of getting into heaven. Mention that at the end of the symphony,  the western Judeo-Christian sounds of choirs, brass and organ, get accompanied by the more 'eastern' sounds of gongs and bells. Hey, it's an angle.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2011, 12:00:04 AM by barry guerrero »

Offline hrandall

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #17 on: June 14, 2011, 03:37:20 PM »
I agree with Wade, in congratulating Herb that he was able to get "several" people together at the same time who are willing to be introduced to Mahler.

Does anyone have a suggestion for Herb as to a couple of "opening lines"--some quick explanation of Mahler or the characteristics of M2 that might pique their interest and put them in a receptive mood to meet their first experience with Mahler?

This is a great idea - give me your best M2 "elevator pitch"!

Barry's is a great start....

Best,
Herb

Offline stillivor

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #18 on: June 15, 2011, 08:00:49 AM »
My pitch for M2 might be to say, truthfully, that the first time i heard it, live at a concert, I had to go, with my frined, to the Royal Festivalk hall cafe and sit down for a bit cos I was shaking.

Otoh, I actually usually don't big up anything I really like as it rather sets up the new listener for a potential fall when it doesn't happen for them.

Actually I'd probably just say,"See what you think of this" and play only the 2nd movement; to see if sheer unadulterated gorgeousness doesn't appeal like it always SHOULD. :-)


   Ivor

john haueisen

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #19 on: June 15, 2011, 10:49:05 PM »
I agree with Ivor's warning not to try to build up expectations.  Blinded by my own love for M2, I have sometimes (even if unconsciously) been pressuring others to appreciate it as I do.
Love cannot be forced.
We can only hope that exposure may lead to appreciation, which may lead to love for it.

Perhaps Ivor is right, that we should keep it low key, with a casual, "What do you think of this?"  Maybe not even mention the title or the composer, and just let the music come to them.  Perhaps they will be as fortunate as many of us have been to be something like "touched by the gods."


   

Offline Roffe

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #20 on: June 17, 2011, 08:05:35 AM »
It turns out that I'm faced with this issue on Thursday. I usually listen to Mahler with a friend of mine on Thursday evenings, and this week we'll have several guests joining us, most of whom have heard at least a portion of M2 before, but one or two that have had little to no Mahler exposure. We will be listening to M2, so I'll let you all know how it's received by this group.

Cheers,
Herb
Herb,

I and maybe others on this board are curious about the outcome of Thursday's event. Hope you had a pleasnt evening.

Roffe

john haueisen

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #21 on: June 17, 2011, 11:50:04 AM »
Yes, Herb and Roffe, we are interested in how the evening went.
I believe that all or many of us would enjoy helping others to appreciate the great beauty and "ability to move one" of Mahler's music.  So tell us Herb:  what did you say before you started the music, and how did your guests react?

John H

Offline hrandall

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #22 on: June 18, 2011, 01:43:10 PM »
Hello Everyone,

Sorry for my late reply, it's been a hectic few days here. To fill you in on my Mahler evening on Thursday:

The evening was hosted by my friend with whom I usually listen to Mahler on Thursday. (Her stereo is better than mine, and she is retired and lives alone so we can listen as loudly as we please). She had invited two friends of hers while I brought along my mother-in-law who is here on a visit from Poland. I would say that each of these three guests new to Mahler have some appreciation for classical music but in a very casual manner.

The two friends of our host had both heard the last 10 minutes of so of M2 because my friend had it played at her husband's funeral service as it was his very favorite.

To prepare for the evening, I had printed out the text for Urlicht and movement 5 for each person. They did ask for a "pre-concert talk", so I gave a very brief overview of the symphony's main themes, using Barry's idea of thinking of the symphony as the humanist, inclusive view of striving towards heaven. I also mentioned David Hurwitz's thoughts about the huge shift in mood between movements 4 and 5 - that Urlicht is a view of simple child-like faith that doesn't quite square with Mahler's true beliefs - hence the opening of movement 5 can be seen as a violent reaction to that sort of faith. I gave a sentence or two of description of each of the 5 movements so they would have some feel for the overall structure of the symphony. I did mention the Wunderhorn origin of the 3rd movement and described the humor of that song with its lyrics of St. Anthony and the fish. I probably spoke for 5 minutes or less altogether.

We took a short break after movement 1, following Mahler's thoughts on the subject. With that pause, I was able to gauge the early reaction a bit. Everyone seemed very impressed and involved, though perhaps a bit surprised at the intensity of the movement. It was interesting to see that as the second movement began, what I think Mahler had mentioned as an interlude after the storm of the first movement, had exactly that effect! Our guests visibly relaxed and for a few moments enjoyed the more peaceful, lyrical strings. Of course with Mahler, those interludes don't usually last for too long... :)

The third movement was a big hit, I think having given them the visual reference of the fish swimming along oblivious to the sermon helped ground the experience for them in something easy to imagine.

Urlicht was another favorite. Well, how can one not like that one, really? I offered to take another short break after that, but everyone was anxious to press ahead, so on we went to the last movement. As it was progressing, I did warn of the upcoming huge timpani rolls and the chaos that comes in after that. Also I explained about the offstage brass and their role in the symphony  as we went along. The choir came in, and it was all smiles for our friends. That sense of having been through a struggle and now having won our reward was palpable. At the conclusion, one of the guests said, simply: "Triumphant!".

The next day I happened to see everyone and get their opinion after having some time to reflect on the experience. Everyone was very positive. I got some compliments for my explanations, but I hastened to credit you all here for your assistance with that! Each of the guests said they would like to come back again for a Mahler night.

I live in a very small town in northern New Hampshire, where cultural events are few and far between. It was encouraging to see people interested and excited in something like this. Who knows? Maybe my little town will have a full-fledged Mahler Society soon! Now word is definitely out about our Mahler Thursday nights. :)

Anyway, thank you for your advice and your interest in my little adventure in Mahler proselytization.

Cheers,
Herb

PS: I suppose if you've read this far, you're curious what version I played for this occasion. I chose one that is not often spoken of as a first choice but is becoming a favorite of mine: Bertini / Cologne from his EMI box set. I have others on CD, but I played that one because I feel it's a nice compromise between the more self-indulgent interpretations (some of which I love!) and the more reserved ones (also some of which appeal to me). I very much appreciate that not only can you hear the bells and organ very clearly at the end, but also the tam-tam in the final few bars. Too often one or all of those get drowned out at the end.

I had given some thought to playing Mehta's version, but the sound quality was not as good and I thought it might be a little off-putting for more casual listeners. I had gone as far as last week testing that CD on my friend's stereo but at louder volumes it just didn't hold up well.

john haueisen

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #23 on: June 18, 2011, 05:00:39 PM »
Wonderful, Herb!

It sounds as if you approached this in the best manner I can imagine. 

I tried a similar approach last year, when I spoke to the Columbus Symphony Women about Mahler.  Although they all were overwhelmingly warm and full of praise for my Mahler talk and music, I did not know until last week how well I had succeeded.  A total stranger came up to me and began shaking my hand and showering me with praise.  She said their group had never experienced such a lecture as mine, and that many of them were sharing more and more Mahler.  Mine was different in that it was intended as a lecture with musical excerpts, but the principle is the same.

I really don't think I have ever done a "Mahler Night" as well as you did on Thursday.  As others here at the board have cautioned, it's important not to scare them off with too many details.  From what you described, you seem to have struck just the right balance, with results that we can all appreciate.  Maybe we can all learn from your example here, and experiment with new ways to share one of the loves of our life.

Thanks, Herb!
--John H

Offline Roffe

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #24 on: June 18, 2011, 05:23:29 PM »
Thank you for sharing, Herb.

Wow! It seems that your Mahler night was a total success. It also seems that M2 is a good Mahler starter for a beginner; I'll keep that in mind.

Please let us know if this group continue to listen to Mahler in the future.

Thanks again and congrats
Roffe

Offline waderice

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #25 on: June 18, 2011, 11:26:13 PM »
Herb, that was indeed a RARE instance that you were able to get a select few of your friends to learn about and appreciate M2.  There are two ladies up the street from me who are originally from Austria, but I know that only one of them has a love of classical music in general, but I'm not absolutely sure about the other.  My wife is able to tolerate Mahler through the fact that I love his music, being as her favorites are Brahms and Handel, but I'm not sure about the two ladies up the street from me.  The fact that your friends may have had a basic knowledge of German (particularly your mother-in-law) could have helped.  Also, the fact that your female friend hosted the event and used a M2 recording as a part of her deceased husband's funeral certainly had to not make the evening as intimidating for her guests as opposed to you hosting it.

I know what I've written above sounds like I'm making excuses for not wanting to host a Mahler event, but I tried to do something similar years ago that your friend did, involving other composers, but nobody came. None of them were of European origin. >:( :'(

Wade
« Last Edit: June 18, 2011, 11:29:49 PM by waderice »

Offline bluesbreaker

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #26 on: June 19, 2011, 01:43:23 PM »
If I were going to recommend a starting point for someone, I would probably say M5, of all things.  Why?  Because there is a clear journey from tragedy to triumph that I think most people will identify with.


I think M2 portraits better in that regard.
Under The Dark Side Of The Glass Moon

john haueisen

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #27 on: June 19, 2011, 04:54:35 PM »
Michael,
I believe you are correct that M2 better builds to an impressive climax.
With at least some introductory explanations, M2 certainly should inspire people to feel the large emotions and grandeur of this expressive work.  M2 has had such an impact upon my life that my tombstone will be inscribed: "sterben werd' ich um zu leben."

My usual problem is the danger of providing "too much explanation."  It is more productive to find balance in telling new listeners enough to stimulate their interest, without overwhelming them with my own passion for Mahler.

John H
« Last Edit: June 19, 2011, 05:16:19 PM by john haueisen »

Offline bluesbreaker

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #28 on: June 19, 2011, 05:11:21 PM »
Michael,................
My usual problem is the danger of providing "too much explanation."  It is more productive to find balance in telling new listeners enough to stimulate their interest, without overwhelming them with my own passion for Mahler.

John H

Tell me about it. I made that mistake myself a few years back.

Michael
Under The Dark Side Of The Glass Moon

Offline Roffe

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Re: introducing Mahler to new listeners
« Reply #29 on: June 20, 2011, 04:21:44 AM »
Michael,................
My usual problem is the danger of providing "too much explanation."  It is more productive to find balance in telling new listeners enough to stimulate their interest, without overwhelming them with my own passion for Mahler.

John H

Tell me about it. I made that mistake myself a few years back.

Michael

Yeah, it's difficult bnot to get carried away. You really have to restrain yourself.

Roffe

 

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