forthcoming T. Fischer/Utah M8 - which download option?

[barryguerrero]

I'd like input as to which download option I should choose. I have only a modest, small speaker system for my computer, but with sufficient bass (separate woofer).  Will 44 kHz be sufficient, or do I want to go with 96? Also, what are the differences between Flac, Apple Lossless and Wav? Thanks in advance.

https://referencerecordings.com/recording/mahler-symphony-no-8/

I want to go with a download to audition the recording, before deciding whether to invest in the hard discs.

[ChrisH]

44khz and flac is what you want.

[barryguerrero]

Thank you. That'll save me from spending more than I need to.

[akiralx]

To play through iTunes you would need to convert the Flac file.

[Roland Flessner]

WAV and FLAC are both lossless, but WAV is not compressed; a full CD worth of WAV files would be around 700Mb, while FLAC would be about half that.

Being a Linux enthusiast, I’m not experienced with Apple stuff and can’t comment on that.

When I rip CDs or FLACs for use on my SanDisk players, computer or phone, I use Ogg Vorbis at 192K. Although it’s a lossy codec, I can’t tell the difference from the original. A full CD rips to around 100Mb. That is no larger than a 256K MP3 and sounds better.

[barryguerrero]

Thanks guys, but that's all Greek to me! You're way beyond me.

[waderice]

Thanks guys, but that's all Greek to me! You're way beyond me.

Barry, from past discussions on technology, I've concluded that you're a regular CD person, and other formats such as SACD, DVD Audio, FLAC, and ALAC are all useless to you because you don't want to get too involved in technology, plus you don't have the capability to play them.  In order to create any regular CD, the format that you're familiar with, you MUST have the raw .WAV file in order to create the regular CD.  That is what you should download in order to create a regular CD.  There is an uncomplicated MS Windows program you can download and install on your computer called CD Burner XP (I assume it's a Windows computer you have, and not Apple).  It's freeware, is easy to work with, is designed to create regular CD's, and none of the other formats.  Here is a link to download to your computer: https://cdburnerxp.se/en/home/.

BUT, you can still play a regular .WAV download on your computer; you will NOT be able to play the .WAV download on a regular CD player.  You MUST create the CD from the .WAV file download in order to play it on your CD player.

I don't think it can be made any simpler than this.

Wade

[Roland Flessner]

To burn an audio CD, it is not necessary to use WAV files; you may use any format supported by your CD burning software. If using a lossless format, your CD should sound exactly the same as one that was commercially produced.

My recollection of CDBurnerXP is that it required one or more additional components, which I prefer to avoid. I’ve used Imgburn with good results, but burning an audio CD requires a couple steps; first you build a CUE file, which is very easy, then make the compilation from that.

If you want to get fancy with CD Text, you can modify the CUE file to show the title, track name and artist exactly as you wish.

As with any downloaded freeware, be careful about malware sneaking in.

If you’d like to reverse the process to extract one or more tracks from a CD, I can recommend CDEX. So for example, if you wish to build a custom compilation, you could extract tracks to FLAC files in CDEX, then build your compilation in Imgburn. Or just to play audio files on your computer, you could extract to a lossy format.

Since I’m a proud Linux user, I use software included in the official repositories. Everything is open source, free of charge and free of malware. I don’t use MP3 because it’s proprietary (someone owns the patent), but it’s easy to add support for it if needed.

[barryguerrero]

Thanks guys, I appreciate it. That does clarify things to a good degree. I haven't been buying downloads for the purpose of burning cd's from them, although I may consider that going forward. I usually just listen to them on my computer, where I spend a fair amount of time anyway. If I decide I want the 'hard copy', I usually find some way to acquire the cd 'on the cheap'. Thanks for taking the time and trouble to help me understand.

[Russell]

Barry, if I may, I would suggest that you download a higher-res version of the file (e.g., 96kHz/24-bit).  Assuming you have a computer that's of fairly recent vintage, you should be able to play the file.  (Depending on your setup, you might have to tweak some settings on your computer so that it's outputting the full resolution.)  Not only should this sound better than standard-CD resolution (44.1 kHz/16-bit) but it will essentially make your purchase "future-proof".  You might or might not be able to hear the difference with your current setup, but you could someday invest in a separate digital-to-analog converter (I'm assuming you don't have one now) that plugs into your computer and processes your music files. You can then connect the converter to your main stereo system or plug in a good pair of headphones-- the sound quality will be much better than listening via your computer alone.

Apologies if this all sounds like gobbledy-goop; I'm happy to clarify if you have any questions.

Russell

[barryguerrero]

Thank you, it's appreciated. Now I'll be fully candid: I'm a hi-tech 'drop out'. I don't even have my decent stereo system in the house. It sits in the garage, and I'll probably just get rid of it all at some point. Instead, I've placed two of the larger Bose Wave systems in the home: one in my bed-room and one in the dining area. The sound quality on the Bose is good enough for the volume levels I use. I'm done with tons of equipment and wires going everywhere, etc. I even refuse to give up my flip phone with the larger numbers on it (I can't read the small stuff). When I bought my last car, a relative said to me, "be sure to get one with a navigation system in it". I answered, "why (?), I'm not lost". Even worse, Apple products drive me insane - I won't have them.

When I was young, our parents bought things to make their lives more simple and convenient, not more complicated. You didn't have to 'know stuff' to run an electric oven or answer a telephone. I think we've completely lost focus that 'things' are there to make our lives easy and simple - so that we can quickly move on to things that are more interesting to us. 

Russell, your suggestion is a good one. But if I did go with the 96kHz download, how would I know that I would need to "tweak some settings"?   .    .   .   and if so, how or where would I find the settings that are relevant? .    .    .  is there a possibility that I could end up making things worse (a genuine concern for someone like me)?

[Russell]

Barry, I was speaking from my experience using a Mac (desktop and laptop). With the Mac OS, there's an audio setting that needs to be changed to ensure that the sound being outputted is at the desired sampling frequency and bitrate (96 kHz/24 bit or whatever the coding of the file).  If the setting is left at its default of 44.1/16, a higher-res file would be downsampled to that default frequency/bitrate.  Not sure if it's the same with PCs, but I suspect this is unique to the Mac. 
(Third-party music players for the Mac--such as Audirvana and JRiver--do this change automatically, but iTunes does not.)

Russell

[waderice]

(Third-party music players for the Mac--such as Audirvana and JRiver--do this change automatically, but iTunes does not.)

Russell

I looked at Apple's App Store and see that Audirvana is available for ten bucks.  JRiver didn't come up after a search.  Is there a link for that one you can refer me to?

Also, do you know if there is a CD ripping program for Mac similar to the MS-based CD Stars Ripper, plus another Apple-based program to produce CDs from WAV files?

Thanks, Wade

[Russell]

Here ya go, Wade:

https://www.jriver.com/index.html

The Mac download link is a little further down that page. To be honest, I like Audirvana better.  It sounds better to me (more smooth and 'rounded') and is much more Mac-like in operation than JRiver, which betrays its PC roots.  (They're still primarily PC-focused, while Audirvana is Mac-only.)  There are other high-quality (read: not free) Mac music players like Pure Music (http://www.channld.com/puremusic/) and HQ Player (http://www.signalyst.com/consumer.html) that people like, but I haven't tried them.

As for a CD ripper, I still use good ol' iTunes (with error correction).  I usually rip to ALAC (Apple lossless) and it seems to do the job well enough for me.  I also use iTunes to produce CDs--again, it seems to do a good job. (I usually burn at 4X.)

Russell

[barryguerrero]

This thread has illuminated things for me. I'm thinking that I'll go with the less expensive 44kHz download to just 'audition' the recording. If I like it from a purely musical standpoint, I'll invest the physical discs. I do have a source where I can get a real break on the price. Thanks guys.