Author Topic: Tilson Thomas M3  (Read 315 times)

Offline Thomass

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 15
Tilson Thomas M3
« on: June 10, 2019, 10:37:25 AM »
Hi everyone,

Haven't been on this board for some time (bit of a Mahler fatigue), but I've been looking into MTT's San Francisco cycle recently. M4 is really good, any thoughts on M3? The final movement seems to be almost as slow as Levine (a personal favourite), with over 26 minutes.
Thanks!

Offline barryguerrero

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 472
Re: Tilson Thomas M3
« Reply #1 on: June 10, 2019, 06:03:45 PM »
Sorry, Thomas, but neither performance is for me. I'm not a fan of that cycle at all. I feel M5 and M9 are the two best ones. I very much like Adam Fischer/Dusseldorf for both M3 and M4.

Offline Thomass

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 15
Re: Tilson Thomas M3
« Reply #2 on: June 10, 2019, 06:22:05 PM »
Do you like the Adam Fischer M3 better than his brother's version? I can't say I ever heard the second and third movements done better than on the Ivan Fischer recording.

Offline barryguerrero

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 472
Re: Tilson Thomas M3
« Reply #3 on: June 10, 2019, 07:17:01 PM »
Yes, I do like it a bit better. Both are good.

Offline erikwilson7

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 39
Re: Tilson Thomas M3
« Reply #4 on: June 10, 2019, 09:54:54 PM »
I admire the MTT cycle for great sound and playing, but I’m not a fan of Tilson Thomas’ “interpretation,” if I would use that term. His tempos are odd sometimes, and I think he misses quite a few essential details in the score on most of the recordings, and some things get lost in the mix. The M3 is pretty good, but if I were to single out any from the whole cycle it’d be 4, 6, and 7 (personal preferences). The 5 and 9 are the only two I haven’t heard, so I’ll have to check those out.

They’re broad, epic, and overly emotional, but Bernstein does that all better.

I also want to second that the Ádám Fischer M3 is excellent, and even a bit better than his brother’s.

Offline barryguerrero

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 472
Re: Tilson Thomas M3
« Reply #5 on: June 10, 2019, 10:50:36 PM »
I actually like MTT's earlier LSO recording of M3, even though it's not so well recorded. It's much less fiddled with, in terms of tempo relationships. It also has the outstanding Janet Baker on board, including her last take on the five Ruckert Lieder. Same with Mahler 7: I prefer MTT's ealier LSO one, which - by the way - is really well recorded (RCA). Not my favorite Mahler conductor by a long shot.

Offline Thomass

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 15
Re: Tilson Thomas M3
« Reply #6 on: June 11, 2019, 09:56:38 AM »
I've never heard MTT's first M3 with the LSO, it's very hard to find. I also like his M7 with the LSO, I'll check out the San Francisco version. I've been listening to Ivan Fischer's rather anemic M7 recently, it can't be much worse than that (I'm sure Fischer's brother is better in that symphony as well). For some reason, the Dutch critics over here (and the British, of course) seem to love Fischer Mahler cycle from Budapest, I honestly can't hear why.

Offline barryguerrero

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 472
Re: Tilson Thomas M3
« Reply #7 on: June 11, 2019, 07:50:33 PM »
Well,   .   .   .  it started out on the right foot. The M2 was really very, very good for a 'modern' recording. I like his M4 and Miah Persson is the perfect, 'boyish' soprano. Then it began to go south, just a bit. The M5 and M9 are truly lightweight. I think the M3 is a bounce back to better form. As we all know, there probably won't be an M8, which means the cycle is done for Ivan Fischer - unless he intends to add "das Lied" or M10, etc.

Adam Fischer, on the other hand, has been consistently good, so far. Indeed, I find his M7 superior to Ivan's. It has the best M7/IV (second Nacthmusik) I've yet to hear. The next issue from Adam Fischer will be M8, coming out in the fall.

There's an awful lot of good Mahler out there. Don't forget to check out some of the recent issues from Jonathan Nott and Markus Stenz. They'll both give us a lot of great Mahler over the coming decades. I like Paavo Jarvi's Mahler very much too - much more so than his father's efforts. It's a wonderful time to be a fan of this music.

Offline erikwilson7

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 39
Re: Tilson Thomas M3
« Reply #8 on: June 11, 2019, 10:29:18 PM »
Iván Fischer’s cycle has given me very mixed feelings. The sound is both amazing and too spacious at the same time. I’ll always return to his M1–4; I feel he gets the Wunderhorn period just right. His M5 starts rather poorly but ends well. A very fine but slightly soft Sixth. The Seventh was too lightweight for me. And yes, a well-recorded but lightweight Ninth.

His brother’s cycle, on the other hand, has impressed me with every release so far. I’m curious about what the good folks of this forum think about Ádám Fischer’s M1 and M5. I think it has the best M1/III I’ve heard. The Fifth might also be one of the best recent recordings.

And speaking of Stenz, I just got his box set in the mail to use as my “car box set.” I couldn’t be happier; I think it might be the most consistently good modern complete cycle, up there with Bertini. It’s too bad he didn’t record Das Lied.

Offline barryguerrero

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 472
Re: Tilson Thomas M3
« Reply #9 on: June 12, 2019, 03:41:23 AM »
Mr. Wilson has taken words straight out of my mouth! And yes, I feel exactly the same way about A. Fischer's M1/III and M5.

Offline Thomass

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 15
Re: Tilson Thomas M3
« Reply #10 on: June 12, 2019, 07:50:03 AM »
We're on the same page as far as Ivan Fischer is concerned. I notice that you haven't mentioned his M1, Barry, which I also quite like. I'll look into the Stenz cycle; I recently heard him conduct DLvdE in the Concertgebouw and was very impressed, despite some less than ideal singing (but then again, I don't believe anyone can really do that piece justice in a live setting).

Offline barryguerrero

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 472
Re: Tilson Thomas M3
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2019, 06:41:11 AM »
Yes, Ivan Fischer's M1 is one of his better Mahler recordings.

 

SMF spam blocked by CleanTalk