OT: Bruckner no. 3, Thilemann/V.P.O./Sony Classical

[barryguerrero]

If you haven't already heard it, give yourself a treat by listening to the Bruckner 3rd symphony at Spotify (or Idagio) with Thielemann/Vienna Phil. on the Sony Classical label. The current day Vienna Phil. sometimes gets accused of 'phoning it in', but that's certainly not the case here - the playing is magnificent and dedicated. The sound quality is excellent too. It's in the middle, 'compromise' version of 1877/'78. It's also of the Nowak edition of that version, which means it has that interesting tag at the end of the scherzo (the Oeser edition leaves it out). If you're not one of these people who insist that Bruckner's 'original intentions' are only represented by his first version, then you may want to give this a shot.

Thielemann's Bruckner 8 with the same forces on Sony Classical took a rough ride with the critics. The first two movements were rather ordinary in execution, but the last two movements were really quite special. I think many of those critics didn't bother to focus in on the final two movements.

If this pandemic business ever comes to a close, it would be nice if Sony Classical could commit to a similar project for Mahler. Their complete Mahler cycle with Lorin Maazel could really use updating at this point. Personally, I would go with the Berlin Phil's idea of using a number of different conductors. The Decca Bruckner box with the Vienna Phil. is set up that way. However, I'd be happy if somebody would just issue the Welser-Most/V.P.O. M8 from Vienna's Konzerthaus.

[erikwilson7]

I'll have to give Thielemann's new Bruckner a listen. I haven't always been a big fan of the guy, though I liked his Alpensinfonie.

Barry are you proposing there should be a new Sony Classical Mahler cycle or a Wiener Philharmoniker Mahler cycle?

Both would be interesting, and I'm sure we could build a wishlist right here on the forum. The trick is that it would ideally be unreleased recordings instead of a simple mix box of pre-existing recordings that any of us could just make on our own.

I for one would be very interested in a Wiener Philharmoniker mixed conductor box, just like their Bruckner one.

For a Sony Classical box they could probably use RCA recordings, which includes Edo de Waart's.

Honestly Sony should just re-issue that in general.

[barryguerrero]

Interesting ideas. I'd love to see the DeWaart Mahler cycle get reissued in one of those white, budget priced Sony Classical boxes. They already did the Levine and Zinman cycles that way. There's some good stuff in that Zinman cycles. I just wish he had had better singers for his M8.

As for Thielemann's Bruckner, his B3 is more consistent than his B8 - meaning that all four movements are good. My prediction is that his upcoming release of B5 with the V.P.O. will be absolutely 'off the hook'.

[erikwilson7]

For the Zinman cycle, I just wish the timpani were better captured and the soloists in M2 weren't much louder than the choir. Other than that, excellent cycle.

I've never heard Thielemann's Bruckner before, except for one: I remember his B7 in the recent BPO cycle being quite good. It looks like he has a video cycle with the Staatskapelle Dresden. Is that one any good? He has various ones with Munich too.

[barryguerrero]

Yes, his Dresden Bruckner is pretty good, for the most part. Unlike his Wagner, he's still 'feeling his way' with Bruckner. However, I really think it's the same story as it is with Mahler. By that, I mean that very few conductors do ALL of the Bruckner symphonies really well. That's why I avoid Bruckner conversations like the plague. Aside from endless, ridiculous discussions about performing versions and editions, Bruckner people are even more 'conductor-centric' than Mahler people. I wish people would realize that a conductor is really no different than your plumber of your electrician: they're flesh and blood mortals who have a job to do. They're really little more than a necessary evil. Yes, of course, some are better than others.