Kondrashin/Melodiya Mahler set

[John Kim]

What are your opinions about this set, especially, 3rd, 6th, and 9th?

I have the 7th as well as his RCO 7th and like them both very much.

There is also Kondrashin/MPO/Atlus M9th live from Tokyo in 1967 (the very first concert of M9th in that country) which I own. It's very fast but doesn't feel rushed thanks to his remarkable control of tempo relationships. I rather like it too.

Thanks.

John,

[ChrisH]

I'm a fan of Kondrashins' Mahler. I like that he's very much straight ahead with them; I don't sense that I'm hearing Kondrashin, just Mahler. His command of the orchestra is astonishing to me. They do what ever he wishes it seems, and they do it quite well. His control of tempo, as you stated, is really remarkable. When I listen to Kondrashin I feel as if he's driving the greatest sports car in the world. Total control, spin on a dime, and that feeling that you never know quite when he's going to put petal to the metal. He's quite exciting to me ears.

His 6th is a ferocious. His 3rd is quite mysterious, and wonderfully constructed, but the posthorn sounds as if it's on-stage with the orchestra. Also, the vocals are all in Russian. His 9th is beautifully Russian/Rustic. You've got to get used to that Russian brass vibrato though.

I would recommend them highly. Especially if you're looking for something a bit outside the norm.

[John Kim]

I'm a fan of Kondrashins' Mahler. I like that he's very much straight ahead with them; I don't sense that I'm hearing Kondrashin, just Mahler. His command of the orchestra is astonishing to me. They do what ever he wishes it seems, and they do it quite well. His control of tempo, as you stated, is really remarkable. When I listen to Kondrashin I feel as if he's driving the greatest sports car in the world. Total control, spin on a dime, and that feeling that you never know quite when he's going to put petal to the metal. He's quite exciting to me ears.

His 6th is a ferocious. His 3rd is quite mysterious, and wonderfully constructed, but the posthorn sounds as if it's on-stage with the orchestra. Also, the vocals are all in Russian. His 9th is beautifully Russian/Rustic. You've got to get used to that Russian brass vibrato though.

I would recommend them highly. Especially if you're looking for something a bit outside the norm.

Thanks.

How about the sound quality?

I heard that in the 9th the percussion is very weak, almost inaudible. Is that right?

John,

[waderice]

How about the sound quality?

John,

If any of Kondrashin's recordings in this set come from the former Soviet Union, generally, any recording coming from there is bound to have inferior sound, even if in stereo.  I've heard, and have enough of them in my collection (mostly Russian composers) to know.  So if you're going to listen to recordings coming from there, don't expect the sound to come up to Western standards of quality.  It just isn't there.  Listen for how the conductor performs the work, not the sound.  I would presume that the RCO recordings to be of good quality.

Wade

[barry guerrero]

Kondrashin's Mahler is very good, but all of the vocals are in Russian!!! (M3/M4).

[Roland Flessner]

I've had the Kondrashin M9 (Moscow Phil) for decades, first on really badly pressed Seraphim LPs, then on a Melodiya CD. It is a driven and compelling performance, with a couple oddities:

In the second movement, the contrabassoon plays a "wrong" note in near the end. I suspect this was due to bad printing in the score that made an G look like an F because the bottom line of the staff was thin or missing. At least one other 1960s recording (maybe Solti/LSO, as I recall) had the same error.

In the Rondo Burlesque, the violins play one note higher in one passage, and it is jarring. I have no idea why they did this.

Those aren't complaints, just comments. I recall a reviewer in High Fidelity praising the strings' "dig in or die" attitude, and that does describe the intensity of this performance.

I heard Kondrashin conduct Mahler at Ravinia around 1980, though I don't remember which symphony; the CSO played the whole cycle that summer. It is amazing that given the limited rehearsal time for the summer concerts, the CSO was effectively transformed into the Kondrashin Philharmonic. He had a genius for imprinting "his" sound in short order.

[John Kim]

I've had the Kondrashin M9 (Moscow Phil) for decades, first on really badly pressed Seraphim LPs, then on a Melodiya CD. It is a driven and compelling performance, with a couple oddities:

In the second movement, the contrabassoon plays a "wrong" note in near the end. I suspect this was due to bad printing in the score that made an G look like an F because the bottom line of the staff was thin or missing. At least one other 1960s recording (maybe Solti/LSO, as I recall) had the same error.

In the Rondo Burlesque, the violins play one note higher in one passage, and it is jarring. I have no idea why they did this.

Those aren't complaints, just comments. I recall a reviewer in High Fidelity praising the strings' "dig in or die" attitude, and that does describe the intensity of this performance.

I heard Kondrashin conduct Mahler at Ravinia around 1980, though I don't remember which symphony; the CSO played the whole cycle that summer. It is amazing that given the limited rehearsal time for the summer concerts, the CSO was effectively transformed into the Kondrashin Philharmonic. He had a genius for imprinting "his" sound in short order.

Thanks!

I ordered the Kondrashin/MPO/Melodiya M9th today. Like I said, I have his live M9th from Tokyo in 1968. It's a brazing performance clocking in just 65 min., probably the fastest ever! The orchestra is amazingly virtuosic and alert from start to finish.

John,

[James Meckley]

I just acquired the 2004 Russian Melodiya 20-bit digital remastering of this set (Symphonies 1, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, & 9) and I think the sound is really pretty good. Except for the thin and watery French horn sound heard in spots, there is none of the obnoxiousness I tend to associate with Soviet recordings from the 60s and 70s. Interestingly, in the movements which include vocals (3-iv, 3-v, and 4-iv), Kondrashin has recorded two versions, one in German and one in Russian.

Kondrashin's No. 9 (1964) is very impressive and, as John has said elsewhere, preferable to the live 1968 Tokyo recording on Altus. I expect to listen to the others over the next week or so. One of the engineers credited is Pyotr Kondrashin, perhaps a brother or other relative of the conductor?

James

[waderice]

I just acquired the 2004 Russian Melodiya 20-bit digital remastering of this set (Symphonies 1, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, & 9) and I think the sound is really very good. Except for the thin and watery French horn sound in spots, there is none of the obnoxiousness I tend to associate with Soviet recordings from the 60s and 70s. Interestingly, in the movements which include vocals (3-iv, 3-v, and 4-iv), Kondrashin has provided two versions, one in German and one in Russian.

This is good news.  With the collapse of the former Soviet Union, we should expect to hopefully hear better results from old Soviet-era recordings as they get remastered over the coming years.  Unfortunately, much (rather, most) of what Soviet-era recordings I have in my collection have the inferior sound that James describes, especially in the early stereo Soviet recordings, particularly by Mravinsky and Temirkanov.  One recording I do have that does not fit within this bunch is a CD transfer of a rather good-sounding M2 by Temirkanov, though I don't recall the year this was made.  It has the faster tempi that Barry seems to like, and fits on one disk. 

Wade

[John Kim]

I just acquired the 2004 Russian Melodiya 20-bit digital remastering of this set (Symphonies 1, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, & 9) and I think the sound is really pretty good. Except for the thin and watery French horn sound heard in spots, there is none of the obnoxiousness I tend to associate with Soviet recordings from the 60s and 70s. Interestingly, in the movements which include vocals (3-iv, 3-v, and 4-iv), Kondrashin has recorded two versions, one in German and one in Russian.

Kondrashin's No. 9 (1964) is very impressive and, as John has said elsewhere, preferable to the live 1968 Tokyo recording on Altus. I expect to listen to the others over the next week or so. One of the engineers credited is Pyotr Kondrashin, perhaps a brother or other relative of the conductor?

James

I don't have the whole set but have the Ninth from 1964. As James wrote the sound is surprisingly good considering the year and the source of the recording. I quite like Kondrashin's way with the symphony, as I like him in his RCO & LPO recordings of the 7th.

John,