Scherchen's Mahler

[umbernisitani]

Scherchen hasn't been talked about very much on this forum.  I think there exist recordings of every Mahler symphony save the Fourth, conducted by Scherchen.  Recently I got hold of the Tahra 4CD set of Scherchen's Mahler 3, 6, 10 and Kindertotenlieder with the Leipzig Radio Symphony Orchestra, recorded in 1960.  The sound is really quite good for the source, and so is the playing.  As for the performances, I've just heard the Sixth and it is undoubtedly a magnificent interpretation.  Scherchen is extremely fast, sometimes even reckless in the first movement (14:03 without repeats), making the music sound terrifically hysterical (which Scherchen believes is the key to performing M6), while the finale is endlessly powerful.

As would be expected, Scherchen makes substantial cuts in the Scherzo and the Finale (as a result there's only one hammer blow in the Finale--the build up to the first hammer blow is tacked onto the second hammer blow, and everything between is cut).  The booklet notes justify this by saying that, given the limited rehearsal time Scherchen was granted, he would rather perform the music cut than give a bad performance.  So that's what he did.  The cuts are all rather smooth but of course Mahlerians will notice the cut.  The Third is uncut, interestingly, and the tempos are all on paper pretty standard (haven't heard it yet).  I've yet to hear the other Scherchen Mahler performances though (I've heard parts of the Westminster 1 and 2).  Thoughts?

[AZContrabassoon]

Scherchen was quite a quixotic conductor who influenced a lot of people - including me. As a beginning classical music collector you couldn't avoid his huge recording legacy - for better and worse. The real shame is that he rarely, if ever, had first-class orchestras to work with. Usually they were scrappy, underrehearsed and rushed. And his book on conducting is a treasure trove of knowledge from a self-taught conductor. I know musicians who played under him and thought he was a wonderful, warm man who absolutely loved to conduct. But boy, could he be weird - the Kalinnikov 1st is unlike any other recording made.

His Mahler: there is something about his recording of the 2nd that makes it essential to Mahlerians. The playing is better than most of his Mahler and the conducting quite powerful. It wouldn't be my desert island 2nd, but as a historical document it's important.

7th: there are several recordings of this, probably his favorite Mahler symphony. My first encounter with his 7th was on a Westminster LP, the notes booklet by James Lyon are still the best ever written for this symphony. The performance was described by Penguin Guide as "brooding" and that's a good way to put it. No orchestra could really be too familiar with it when it was recorded, and the version is the pre-Mahler Society corrected/final version - but without a score you'd be hard pressed to hear differences. It's a fascinating recording to hear how it was performed before it became standard. I might be mistaken, but thi was the first recording made of the symphony. If this were the last Mahler 7th I ever heard, that wouldn't be so bad. Well worth hearing.

The Scherchen Mahler that I was stunned by is the 5th with Philadelphia. Such a different sound than Ormandy was getting at the time - thrilling performance and for once, a world-class orchestra. If you want to hear it, get it from jpc.de where the price won't shock you.

[waderice]

The Scherchen Mahler that I was stunned by is the 5th with Philadelphia. Such a different sound than Ormandy was getting at the time - thrilling performance and for once, a world-class orchestra. If you want to hear it, get it from jpc.de where the price won't shock you.

The Scherchen M5 with Philadelphia is part of the Philadelphia Orchestra Centennial CD set.  It has the SLOWEST Adagietto I've ever heard, clocking in at slightly over 15 minutes!

Wade

[barry guerrero]

"The Scherchen M5 with Philadelphia is part of the Philadelphia Orchestra Centennial CD set.  It has the SLOWEST Adagietto I've ever heard, clocking in at slightly over 15 minutes!"

The Scherchen/Philly M5 is THE most extreme M5 imaginable. As I recall, Scherchen put pretty significant cuts in the middle movement scherzo. Both the second movement and the finale were just wildly fast - the exact polar opposite of the Adagietto. It's an interesting and superbly played M5. Not for the faint of heart.

Beyond that, the only Scherchen items I've heard and really liked were his fast "Eroica" and his muscular Haydn recordings. He's just too extreme for me, and the playing he gets often times leaves much to be desired.

[AZContrabassoon]

But let's not forget that fabulous Mahler-influenced 3rd symphony of Reinhold Gliere. Kudos to Scherchen for pulling that one off. The first complete recording, in glorious mono, is still in many ways the one to beat.

[barry guerrero]

OK. I've never even seen that before.

[Leo K]

I've been intensively listening to Scherchen's Mahler as of late. In particular his M3 from 1950 and his M6. Scherchen's M3 from 1950 (and 1960 for that matter) is so true and raw. The orchestra sometimes struggles but that gives Scherchen's rendition such personality and power. I love it! Same with the M6, which is incredible. I love that it is fast and reckless sounding. I can see it becoming my preferred M6. It brings a fresh outlook to the M6 and gives me a new appreciation to a work I've almost got tired of over the last five years. Regarding the cut* in the finale, for some reason I'm fine with it - I always felt the finale was too long  !

[*note]
Scherzo: cut from nb 65 to 80 (pages 98 to 118)
Finale: cut from nb 129 to 140 (pages 194 to 216)

[waderice]

Interesting that you tell us that Scherchen's M6 is fast in tempo where, when he appeared in Philly in 1964 to perform M5, the Adagietto timed in at the slowest of any recording of that movement I know - 15:04!

Wade

[barry guerrero]

As I said, he's a conductor of wild extremes. My problem with that sort of thing, is that the topic becomes about the conductor, and not about what it was that the composer actually wrote.

And as I pointed out before, Mahler - a man of frequent contradictions - said in a press interview that happened late in his life in New York, "a conductor is little more than a necessary evil". Something like that.

And Leo, I'm not in any way trying to overpower you, but I can't begin to imagine cutting even a single bar to the finale of M6. IMHO, there's not a superfluous note in it. If you want save time and energy with M6, why not just leave out the scherzo altogether?

[Leo K]

And Leo, I'm not in any way trying to overpower you, but I can't begin to imagine cutting even a single bar to the finale of M6. IMHO, there's not a superfluous note in it. If you want save time and energy with M6, why not just leave out the scherzo altogether?

I totally understand Barry - I should be clear I love the whole of Mahler's 6th, it's just nice to have an abridged version of the finale to save time on some days.

[James Meckley]

For Scherchen fans, the Berkshire Record Outlet (broinc.com) is currently offering for sale a 27-disc Scribendum set titled The Art of Hermann Scherchen, priced at $53.73. Their description of it is as follows:

"Recorded 1951-62, pieces include Carl Orff's 'Entrata', Gliere's Third Symphony, Mahler's Symphonies 1, 2, 5, 7 + Adagio from Symphony #10, Overtures by Reznicek, Herold & Auber, Khachaturian's 'Gayaneh' Suite and Symphonies by Beethoven, Brahms & Tchaikovsky. Ensembles include The English Baroque Orchestra, Vienna Symphony Orchestra, Vienna State Opera Orchestra and Royal Philharmonic. Soloists incl. Nan Merriman, Leopold Simoneau, Maria Stader and Petre Munteanu)."

The Mahler material—and much of the remainder—seems to have been licensed from Westminster/DG.

Berkshire is also offering Scribendum's The Art of Jascha Horenstein, five discs for $29.95, described as follows:

"Strauss, Death and Transfiguration. Hindemith, 'Mathis der Maler' Symphony. Mahler, Symphonies 1, 3 [London Symphony. With Norma Proctor and choruses. Rec. 7/70, 5/72, 9/69 & 7/70] & 6 [Stockholm Philharmonic. Rec. 'live', 4/66]. Brahms, Symphony #2 [Danish Radio Symphony. Rec. 'live', 3/16/72]. (All recordings licensed from Unicorn-Kanchana Records)"

A good opportunity to pick up the Horenstein Mahler material for those who still want it for their collections.

James

[AZContrabassoon]

Not to mention his superb Gliere Ilya Murometz!

[barry guerrero]

"Berkshire is also offering Scribendum's The Art of Jascha Horenstein, five discs for $29.95"

That would interest me much more.