Author Topic: Received copy of Jurowski/L.P.O. M8 - link to my Amazon review now posted  (Read 3916 times)

Offline barryguerrero

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I'm not sure I'm going to 'keep' the Jurowski/LPO M8. They left on applause at the end of both Part I and Part II. It would have been far more effective to have left on just the Part I applause, thus going into silence at the end of the symphony. There's some great playing from the L.P.O. and Jurowski adds many, minor interpretive touches. The problem is, those ideas aren't always an improvement (sometimes, yes). The vocal soloists are a real mixed bag too. To me, tenor Barry Banks is a bit disappointing. Most puzzling to me, is the treatment of the children's chorus. They're wonderfully present in their first two entrances in Part II. However, they're almost inaudible near the end of Part I, especially at the crucial part where they come roaring in with the countermelody (a part where they should be very much heard). Any thoughts out there?

I plan to keep this long enough to write a long and detailed 'customer' review of it for Amazon.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2021, 06:26:23 AM by barryguerrero »

Offline brunumb

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Re: Received my CD copy of Jurowski/L.P.O. M8
« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2021, 06:01:59 AM »
 ::)  This is now the 8th separate thread devoted to the Jurowski M8, most of them largely trivial in nature.  Wouldn't it be better and more convenient for everyone to make all posts relating to this disc in the one thread?  I was sorely tempted to even start a 9th just to make this comment.  Sheesh.

Offline erikwilson7

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Re: Received my CD copy of Jurowski/L.P.O. M8
« Reply #2 on: October 06, 2021, 01:28:10 PM »
Careful, I hear that one's 9th thread is destined to be their last.

Jokes aside, I agree. We should be more cognizant of thread clutter.

As for this M8, I think it's mostly very good but I agree with Barry's criticisms. I also think the higher strings (particularly the violas?) are extremely close-miked and way up in the mix. I especially noticed it in the orchestral prelude to Part 2.

Jurowski does a very fine job with the score, but there are a few bumps in the road with sound and performance. Personally, I prefer this one to Tennstedt's titanic live LPO 8th just because it's much more middle of the road. This is a fine 8th, though it doesn't rank with the very best. I'd certainly enjoy listening to it more.

Offline barryguerrero

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Re: Received my CD copy of Jurowski/L.P.O. M8
« Reply #3 on: October 06, 2021, 07:08:59 PM »
I don't really see an issue here, since there's so little 'new' Mahler to talk about. I'm certainly not going to cover reductions, because I don't like them and I don't want them. Perhaps others could occasionally contribute something, and then we wouldn't have to wait weeks and weeks and weeks for something new to read. Sheesh yourself.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2021, 11:06:56 PM by barryguerrero »

Offline brunumb

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Re: Received my CD copy of Jurowski/L.P.O. M8
« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2021, 07:43:26 AM »
Every new post takes a thread to the top of the list and there is an orange tag to notify you of which ones you haven't read.  My point is that it is so much more convenient to have all posts relating to a specific subject together in the one thread so that you can scroll back and see what else was previously written if you want a reminder.  Otherwise you have to go searching through scattered threads when it is completely unnecessary.

I agree that there is not much action here and any new posts are most welcome.  I'm sorry that I can't really offer anything of value myself as I am a complete musical numpty and can't tell the difference between an arpeggio and a contrabassoon or whatever.  I come here to see what you experienced musicologists have to offer and thank everyone for their valuable insights.

Offline erikwilson7

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Re: Received my CD copy of Jurowski/L.P.O. M8
« Reply #5 on: October 08, 2021, 01:12:04 PM »
I’m really glad you’re a part of this forum, brunumb. Your musical inexperience brings a fresh set of eyes (or ears, if you will). A diverse group of opinions is what keeps places like this interesting.

If we all just agreed on one conductor or cycle as the greatest then there’d be nothing more to talk about!

I also wish there could be more action here, but such is the nature of forums about a classical composer.

There’s plenty of action over at the Facebook Mahler group these days but it’s mostly blurry photos of Mahler with cheesy captions or arguments about the 10th symphony’s validity.

Offline Russ Smiley

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Re: Received my CD copy of Jurowski/L.P.O. M8
« Reply #6 on: October 08, 2021, 02:16:35 PM »
I came late to M8, with Tennstedt's studio recording being my introduction to the work. Frankly, that performance just did not click for me. I think it was Bertini's performance in the EMI box that I found satisfying from start to finish. I have added Jarvi, Gergiev, Zinman, Wit, Runnicles, YNS, and others to my collection with various degrees of satisfaction with them (they are NOT listed in order of preference).

I liked the Jurowski/LPO team's M2 and M1, so I favorably anticipated the arrival of this new M8 recording. However, I was displeased with my first hearing. I listened while I was working at my desk on inexpensive computer speakers. Multitasking is not a great way to be critical of details, but I usually do get a decent sense of the tempi, nuances, and overall approach and whether they are to my liking or not.

I heard things throughout this first listening that I hadn't noticed before in the symphony. I like new revelations if they are edifying and not perverse, and some here were. However, there were things that were missing, too. I heard some sour high brass and recessed low brass when they should not have been. It seemed like I was on a roller coaster of favorable to unfavorable impressions.

The interplay of brass, percussion, organ, and choir rising to a thrilling conclusion in Alles Vergangliche usually is as awe inspiring as music gets. Here I heard exchanges that just did not seem right. I did not have a score, but it sounded to me that some sections of the ensemble maybe were entering at the wrong time. I then played the last track of the other M8 recordings and did not hear the effects I heard on this LPO recording. I am not certain my concern is valid (maybe this performance unveiled features that were muddled in others) but this final track simply was not as satisfying to me as my other recordings.

I then listened to the CD in my car on a 40 minute drive: though long enough only to get through half of it, it helped to develop my criticism. I noticed the variable imbalance of the soloists and sections of the choir and orchestra. At times it seemed like a directional mic was on a solo viola or violin yet at other times a whole section of bellowing low brass sounded distant (a tuba and phalanx of trombones can overwhelm, yet at times they seemed suppressed and not just holding back). The directionality of some of the soloists led me to believe that perhaps this was a highly engineered recording and that audio 'magic' was a bit too much for me.

Getting back to the interpretation, I thought Part I was generally satisfactory, though I did not like some of the voices right from the start (this may be unfair because I was uncritical of the voices in the Gergiev while others were troubled by the accents). When it came to Part II, I noticed sometimes that the pacing seemed unnaturally curt, choppy. If the intention was to ensure that clarity came across to a vast audience, then the effort certainly was worthwhile, but as recorded, it sounded at times too fastidious. I no longer own the Jarvi/BIS recording, but in some ways this new recording reminded me of it. It just did not strike me as an integrated, organic whole but more of a showcase event.

Perhaps this assessment should be defended with some more score research: I may get to that later. However, I have listened to other recordings - most decent if not exemplary in interpretation and/or sound quality - and I think I will not revisit this one very often.
Russ Smiley

Offline barryguerrero

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Re: Received my CD copy of Jurowski/L.P.O. M8
« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2021, 08:20:21 PM »
"If the intention was to ensure that clarity came across to a vast audience, then the effort certainly was worthwhile, but as recorded, it sounded at times too fastidious"    .      .       .

Russ, I think that's a really astute observation about this particular recording. Allegedly, Jurowski had soloists and some choral sections shifting positions during the performance. If so, I think that could account for some of the really odd inconsistencies, in terms of balances. Obviously, the microphones couldn't be moved around as well. I had already mentioned the strange 'comings and goings' of the children's chorus. They're so wonderfully present in the more Mendelssohn-like, scherzo passages of Part II. Yet, they seem to be out in north London during the concluding "Gloria" section of Part I.

In addition, it's an odd coincidence that you brought up the Neemi Jarvi M8 - not because the Jurowski one resembles it much, but rather that I was staring at two used copies of it at my local used CD store. I was thinking about how in spite of Jarvi's fast 'run through' approach to the work was, I enjoyed his huge tam-tam smashes at the end of Part II. They were inexpensive copies, so I might go back and pick up one of them (trade a few things). It just goes to show that I'm very much like one of Beecham's audience members: I just like the noise that music makes.


 

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