Finally got Chailly boxset!

[Wunderhorn]

It took BMG a long time to ship it to me, but now having received it for under $45 I'm very pleased. Chailly plays with the textures of sound as though Mahler was a precursor to Varese, a laughable idea but it still works somehow. The 8th and 10th (Cooke) I'm still mostly unfamiliar with. I'm sure the discovery of each will be to me, as a box of bonbons to a bored housewife.   

[Leo K]

I just bought Chailly's M8 used the other day.  I haven't heard it yet, but it's on my list!!

You got that set for a great price!

I'm problably going to get the Bertini set very soon.

[barry guerrero]

Mahler as precursor to Varese is not in the slightest bit, "a laughable idea". One concept that a lot of people simply can not get in their minds, is that Mahler was absolutely dead serious about percussion. It's far more comfortable to think of Mahler as Brahms or Dvorak, but with more brass, and a bit of percussion sprinkled on top for good measure. That's hardly the case at all. If you study the scores, you'll see that Chailly is not exaggerating the presence of his percussion in relation to the dynamic markings in those scores. In the latest De La Grange book, there's a chapter that covers an eyewitness account of Mahler rehearsing his 6th symphony in Munich. He spent a great amount of time and energy working on percussion issues in those rehearsals. It's not a very long step from M6 to "Ameriques" or Arcana". In fact, M3/1 has almost as much percussion as M6/4.

[John Kim]

I have the M2,M3,M6,M8,M9,M10 and like them all except for the M2. Get the SACD versions of the M3 & M9. They sound fabulous, much better than the regular CDs.

John,

[BorisG]

I have the M2,M3,M6,M8,M9,M10 and like them all except for the M2. Get the SACD versions of the M3 & M9. They sound fabulous, much better than the regular CDs.

John,

Sound fabulous, much better than regular CDs? Maybe I misunderstood. This sort of statement is always confusing to me, since there should be no sound difference from the CD layer in SACD and regular.

[John Kim]

Sound fabulous, much better than regular CDs? Maybe I misunderstood. This sort of statement is always confusing to me, since there should be no sound difference from the CD layer in SACD and regular.
[/quote]

There is difference, sometime huge difference. The reason is the regular CD track on SACD is remastered when they make SACD and as a result it sounds better than the regular CD itself. Thus I am told by experts.

John,

[BorisG]

Sound fabulous, much better than regular CDs? Maybe I misunderstood. This sort of statement is always confusing to me, since there should be no sound difference from the CD layer in SACD and regular.

There is difference, sometime huge difference. The reason is the regular CD track on SACD is remastered when they make SACD and as a result it sounds better than the regular CD itself. Thus I am told by experts.

John,
[/quote]

I agree, if you are referring to SACDs like DG Karajan 1963 Beethoven, Mercury Living Presence, or RCA Living Stereo, where there is no new corresponding regular CD reissued along with these.

In the case of new recordings when a SACD Hybrid and a corresponding regular CD are issued simultaneously, the Hybrid's CD layer and the regular CD are generally the same sound. I've read nothing in professional or "expert" material to support your Chailly M3 and M9 SACD Hybrid CD layer claim. Please provide the documentation if you have it.

[John Kim]

I don't need a document to support the claim because my ears simply tell me the CD layer of the hybrid SACD > regular CD of the same recording. But then I compared only for Chailly M3 & M9. I wouldn't know about other cases...

John,

[barry guerrero]

I concure with John. I was skeptical at first, but John was the one who talked me into making the A/B comparisons. Sometimes the differences are quite drastic.

[BorisG]

Sorry, fellas, unless you can show some "expert" proof about Decca and others diverting from their normal course of action, your claim for Chailly M3 and M9 is a no-go, as far as I am concerned. My comparison experience was with the two M3s. I heard no difference. Unless I see some "expert" documentation, this case is closed.

[barry guerrero]

Yes; the case IS closed. Thank god.   

[chris]

It took BMG a long time to ship it to me, but now having received it for under $45 I'm very pleased. Chailly plays with the textures of sound as though Mahler was a precursor to Varese, a laughable idea but it still works somehow. The 8th and 10th (Cooke) I'm still mostly unfamiliar with. I'm sure the discovery of each will be to me, as a box of bonbons to a bored housewife.   

I'm interested on what you (and anyone else) thinks about the opening tempo in the first movement in the Sixth....to me, it doesn't work, but it's certainly an interesting take.

[Leo K]

Here's a live performance of the M6 by Chailly (recently posted on the Mahler list):

Date and venue is unknown at this time.

Deutsches Sinfonieorchester Berlin conducted by Riccardo Chailly.

http://rapidshare.com/files/17193627/chaillymahler6.mp3.001
http://rapidshare.com/files/17193524/chaillymahler6.mp3.002

[barry guerrero]

"I'm interested on what you (and anyone else) thinks about the opening tempo in the first movement in the Sixth....to me, it doesn't work, but it's certainly an interesting take".

I'm not bothered by the relatively slow tempo for the start of the symphony. In fact, I think it helps in making a strong contrast to the sweeping, lyrical second subject: the so-called Alma theme. What I am somewhat bothered by, is Chailly's refusal to speed up at the end of the first movement. However, Chailly may have Mahler on his side, as Mahler doesn't call for a big speed-up (I forget what he wrote, but I'll go look it up later). Since Chailly's scherzo is a bit on the slower, more lumbering side of the equation, it's probably a good thing that he didn't end the first movement with a super-fast tempo.

In summary, I would have liked just a slightly faster ending to the first movement, matched by a slightly faster tempo for the start of the scherzo. That would be more my ideal of how that transition should go. In fact, I've often toyed with the idea - just in my mind, that is - that the last note of the first movement should also be the first note of the scherzo. It would have to be a solo timpani note, obviously.

[Wunderhorn]

Now that I've owned the Chailly boxset for awhile an have gotten to know it, symphonies 2,6,7 are displeasing to me. 7th is far too slow, 6th has unusual percussion i. e. the Andante moderato. In the 2nd Chailly is making the music something it isn't. This is dissappointing, I might sell the set and generally stay away from Chailly. I don't even care for the way he slows down for drama in the opening of the Third. Sound is outstanding, Concertgebouw is outstanding, Chailly I can do without.