Author Topic: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions  (Read 17216 times)

Offline sperlsco

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M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« on: November 07, 2007, 10:02:19 PM »
Absolutely top notch! Macal conducts with tempos that are flowing, but perfectly controlled.  The famous Czech winds bring out all of the colours in the music, and the brass are glorious.  This is also one of the best and most natural-sounding multi-channel SACD's I've heard to date. 

The opening movement has all of the proper gravitas at 22 or so minutes.  The timings of the middle three movements are very similar to the MTT/SFSO.  However, Macal is much more musical sounding in the first nachtmusik.  The scherzo is of the slower, perhaps brooding variety.   The second nachtmusik has very prominent guitar and mandolin.  My preference is for a slightly faster tempo here, but this is well within reason.  My only minor complaints relate to the final movement.  The solo violin is a little too closely miked and comes off as a bit edgy.  The timpani sound rather recessed at two different stages – a section near the opening and again playing the same section near the ending.  This may very well have been a conscious decision, since the timpani are well represented at all other sections.  I also would have liked the bells to be more prominent at the coda.  However, they are still prominent enough to be heard – unlike in the MTT/SFSO.  I noticed in both of the last two movements that Macal has a very unique way with the tension and release of the music throughout (i.e. very different from that of other M7 conductors).  It all works very well to my ears, instead of sounding like some strange affectation a la the MTT/SFSO performance.

So at least after my initial complete listening session, I would place this in my first tier of favorite M7’s, along with Lennie (any of his three, but I especially like his DG one), Abbado (also, any of his three), Tennstedt/LPO (live only), MTT/LSO, Levine/CSO, all off the top of my head.  Oh yeah, I like the Rattle M7 too. 

I really need to type some full comments on the Macal/Czech PO M5 and M6.  I’ll try to do this in another thread.  To summarize, the M6 is very good.  It has quick tempos in the first two movements (btw S-A order), but they are not too fast for my taste.  The andante has a great flow and is thankfully NOT played like an Adagio.  The finale is weighty and features tremendous playing by the Czech PO. 

As for the M5, I have only listened to the first three movements.  It does not come off near as well as the M4, M6, or M7.  It is very rhythmically stiff to my ears.  I am told that the M5 was Macal's first Mahler concert with the Czech PO, so that may explain the strange variance in conducting (i.e. none of the others come off as "stiff"). 
Scott

Offline barry guerrero

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Re: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2007, 08:23:19 AM »
Thanks for the great update, Scott. Could we trouble you for timings?

Barry

Offline Leo K

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Re: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2007, 03:07:01 PM »
Sounds like a great recording...I do plan on getting this as well.  Thanks Scott for the great review!



--Leo

Offline sperlsco

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Re: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« Reply #3 on: November 09, 2007, 03:35:42 AM »
Timings:

22:18, 15:25, 10:13, 13:47, 17:36 (no applause)

recorded May 3-4, 2007
Scott

Offline barry guerrero

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Re: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« Reply #4 on: November 10, 2007, 05:01:20 PM »
Thank you Scott. By way of comparison, here are the timings for Ashkenazy/Czech Phil.

I - 21:13; II - 14:34; III - 9:40; IV - 12:30; VI - 16:39
Barry
« Last Edit: November 10, 2007, 05:04:13 PM by barry guerrero »

Offline Leo K

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Re: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« Reply #5 on: November 21, 2007, 04:20:44 PM »
The Kobayashi and Macal M7 (both SACD) came in the mail yesterday...first here are my first impressions on the Macal M7: 

Scott's review is very accurate.  One of the best sounding orchestral recordings/SACD yet...Exton has great engineering as usual.  The performance is straightforward, but controlled with "Haitink-like" architecture, in other words, full of tension and release in the right passages with great dynamics.  One of those performances where as Barry says, "It's like a conductor throws the score on your lap, perfectly executed by the orchestra...with almost no interpretation in the way."  Thats how this sounds.  It's a "lighter" M7 than Barenboim or Abbado, not as dark or ironic as some have taken it...rather I was surprised to find a very "Wunderhorn-like" sound world instead, with "Das Lied von der Erde" premonitions  in the center three movements.  My only quibbles being the same as Scott's, some recessed timpani in certain passages in the Finale, and the bells are not as loud as they could be...although this is not enough to prevent a very satisfying M7.  I enjoy Macal's objective "icey" beauty, I hear this same quality in his M4 also on Exton.

On the other side of the coin we have Kobayashi's account.  Darker, heavier, and very "Klempereresque"--if Klemp had been well in the later 60's he might of made an M7 like this.  Kobayashi shows much insight in every movement...special mention must be made of the brass and percussion...very well captured on this SACD, not as clear as the sound of Macal's, but powerful and atmospheric, just like Kobayashi's M3 SACD on Exton.  Also, the cowbells and bells are better heard here.  The Nachtmusik II is played so rapturously...Kobayashi gives it a wieght of importance I don't usually hear.  There are so many great details in all the movements, and great dynamics and flow.  This is more an "interpetation" than Macal, but one of insight and action, capturing many moods with the incredible CPO sonority...a sonority enjoyed on both these recordings.

These two M7's reside at the top of my M7 favorites with the Horenstein and Barenboim.  I could live with just these four.

--Leo


Offline John Kim

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Re: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« Reply #6 on: November 22, 2007, 04:58:08 PM »
The Kobayashi/CPO/Exton M7th is on the very top of my list. Like Leo mentioned, Kobayashi's conducting reminds me that the piece is a panorama of spectacular and rapturously beautiful moments and passages. After all, the music resembles M3rd closely and his interpretation is very much the other side of the coin he showed in his M3rd recording.

John,

Offline akiralx

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Re: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« Reply #7 on: November 23, 2007, 12:38:52 PM »
Sounds like a great recording...I do plan on getting this as well.



--Leo

Sadly Macal's dreadfully boring CzPO (!) New World on an Exton SACD has put me off him a bit.

Offline John Kim

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Re: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« Reply #8 on: November 23, 2007, 07:11:03 PM »
I also found Macal's M4th on Exton on the dull side, except for the finale where the singing is so outstanding.

John,

Offline Leo K

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Re: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« Reply #9 on: November 23, 2007, 07:47:00 PM »
I now prefer Boulez/CO/DG SACD M4 over the Macal M4/Exton...but I'll still keep the Macal.

--Leo

Offline sperlsco

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Re: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« Reply #10 on: November 26, 2007, 09:31:27 PM »
The Kobayashi and Macal M7 (both SACD) came in the mail yesterday...

On the other side of the coin we have Kobayashi's account.  Darker, heavier, and very "Klempereresque"--if Klemp had been well in the later 60's he might of made an M7 like this.  Kobayashi shows much insight in every movement...special mention must be made of the brass and percussion...very well captured on this SACD, not as clear as the sound of Macal's, but powerful and atmospheric, just like Kobayashi's M3 SACD on Exton.  Also, the cowbells and bells are better heard here.  The Nachtmusik II is played so rapturously...Kobayashi gives it a wieght of importance I don't usually hear.  There are so many great details in all the movements, and great dynamics and flow.  This is more an "interpetation" than Macal, but one of insight and action, capturing many moods with the incredible CPO sonority...a sonority enjoyed on both these recordings.

I hadn't lstened to the Kobayashi M7 in a while, but gave it a spin over the long Thanksgiving weekend.  Its timings are rather long (hence the dark/heavy comments) and similar to the live Tennstedt one from the 90's, which is one of my all-time favorites.  However, it is not a similar conception.  Kobaysahi does not draw as much of a contrast among the differing tempo relationships throughout like Tennstedt.  Kobayashi is slower and more methodical throughout, whereas Tennstedt is both fast and slower and plays up the dynamics in the music more (note: both have a similarly long and methodical approach to the Nachtmusik II) .  That is NOT to say that Kobayashi is dull or inflexible.  However, I much prefer Tennstedt's way when going with the longer timings (IIRC, both are I-23:30-24+, II - 17+, III - 11+, IV - 15+, V - 18:30-19+). 

As for Kobayashi v. Macal, Kobayashi indeed has much better bells in his finale.  However, I prefer the overall brisker Macal over the comparatively methodical Kobayashi. 
Scott

Offline sperlsco

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Re: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2007, 09:33:47 PM »
I also found Macal's M4th on Exton on the dull side...
John,

Not me.  This is one of my first tier favorite M4's, per my prior review thread. 
 ;D
Scott

Offline Leo K

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Re: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« Reply #12 on: November 26, 2007, 09:47:24 PM »
The Kobayashi and Macal M7 (both SACD) came in the mail yesterday...

On the other side of the coin we have Kobayashi's account.  Darker, heavier, and very "Klempereresque"--if Klemp had been well in the later 60's he might of made an M7 like this.  Kobayashi shows much insight in every movement...special mention must be made of the brass and percussion...very well captured on this SACD, not as clear as the sound of Macal's, but powerful and atmospheric, just like Kobayashi's M3 SACD on Exton.  Also, the cowbells and bells are better heard here.  The Nachtmusik II is played so rapturously...Kobayashi gives it a wieght of importance I don't usually hear.  There are so many great details in all the movements, and great dynamics and flow.  This is more an "interpetation" than Macal, but one of insight and action, capturing many moods with the incredible CPO sonority...a sonority enjoyed on both these recordings.

I hadn't lstened to the Kobayashi M7 in a while, but gave it a spin over the long Thanksgiving weekend.  Its timings are rather long (hence the dark/heavy comments) and similar to the live Tennstedt one from the 90's, which is one of my all-time favorites.  However, it is not a similar conception.  Kobaysahi does not draw as much of a contrast among the differing tempo relationships throughout like Tennstedt.  Kobayashi is slower and more methodical throughout, whereas Tennstedt is both fast and slower and plays up the dynamics in the music more (note: both have a similarly long and methodical approach to the Nachtmusik II) .  That is NOT to say that Kobayashi is dull or inflexible.  However, I much prefer Tennstedt's way when going with the longer timings (IIRC, both are I-23:30-24+, II - 17+, III - 11+, IV - 15+, V - 18:30-19+). 

As for Kobayashi v. Macal, Kobayashi indeed has much better bells in his finale.  However, I prefer the overall brisker Macal over the comparatively methodical Kobayashi. 

I have really enjoyed both the Macal and Kobayashi M7...they are very different indeed.  The sound on the Macal is so pristine and illuminating on the score.

I have not heard the Tennstedt M7, is this a live recording?  I am very curious on hearing his M7 on BBC Legends...has anyone heard this yet?

--Leo

Offline bluesbreaker

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Re: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2007, 01:14:38 AM »
Yea I am also curious about KT's M7 from BBC. Is that the same with the EMI live?
Can't wait!
Under The Dark Side Of The Glass Moon

Offline sperlsco

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Re: M7, Macal, Czech PO - First Impressions
« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2007, 03:57:23 PM »
Yea I am also curious about KT's M7 from BBC. Is that the same with the EMI live?
Can't wait!

No, these are two different performances.  There are now 3 different M7's with Tennstedt and the London PO:

BBC Label - Live from August 1980
EMI Label - Studio from October 1980
EMI Label - Live from May 1993

I have the BBC release on order from MDT, and may have it this weekend.  I am anxious to see if Tennstedt captures the same magic he had in his later live EMI recording, since I find his studio one to be a complete dullard.  The studio one has none of the magic of the live 90's one. 
Scott

 

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